Hi guys, Really a point of order... sorry list, this has sod all to do with Linux. OK, Gotta have two penneth here, happen to be well versed in both Theology and Religious History, I have for 5 years also been involved in cult exit counselling so I have seen the extremes of religious practice.
David Freeman wrote:
To: Jenny_Hopkins@toby-churchill.com, alug@stu.uea.ac.uk
--- Jenny_Hopkins@toby-churchill.com wrote:
The problem is parenting ansd socail responsiblity aren't impressed upon people, which as much as it hurts me to say it, because the lack of
infleunce
of religion on people. The church had the role of teaching people on moral issues and educating and supporting them through raising there off spring.
Because of enforcing bible in latin only and underpinning the snobbish practice of french being the de-facto language of the ruling classes the Church (ie the Catholic Church as-was) enforced ignorance on people. Thus the masses were not empowered by a moral code because they were unable to read it. Anyone translating the Bible into the common tongue was burned at the stake for it. After the reformation the bible ("the common Moral code") became available to all in the common tongue, however one still had to fall in line with the received interpretation of such else face a similar penalty. Thus rather than an morally uplifting mechanism for society religion has merely been a conformance-enforcement mechanism for a pre-determined 'moral, legal' code.
Jen's soapbox of the day: Religion does not have a monopoly on morality. Religion is responsible for a lot of bad stuff. Religion was made to control, and the people in charge of it abuse their power. Morality through fear is not a solution.
People have a monopoly on morality. People have chosen over the years to abdicate the responsibility that comes with morality to Religion. Morality is in effect conscience with laws. We know its wrong to commit murder, but without a common agreed law we would have nothing to train our consciences of that fact. Religion gives direction to our morality, validation and enforcement. Allowing us to trust our consciences by ensuring it complies with the moral code as interpreted by religion. The post-modernist world does away with the 'absolute truth' aspect of religious beleif ("Well, if it's true for you" is the mantra of the post-modernist). I think it is this aspect of society that is being highlighted in the comments leading up to this exchange.
true, it is not an ideal situation, and I am in know way religious. But they acted as a guide and the simple existance of a book of rules which people read helps (bible , Torah etc...) The problem we have here is one best described by Douglas adams "any person whos wants to be presedent shouldn't be" and the same is true for the church, unfortunatly like most big institutions it becam corrupt.
Intelligence and understanding should be the teachers of humanity. And how are people going to be intelligent or understanding without a fair chance in life?
And in history who where the few literate people? the church, who would then be able to guide people? the church. who had medical knowlegde? the church.
As mentioned above, corruption becomes possible through the concentration of such power (assertion : knowledge=power) in the hands of a select few.
The church has been the corner stone of our society for so long and although bits of it are corrupt it's overall effect has been a good one.
Good being a relative term, had the Church not survived beyond the 1st Century we cannot say whether the final result would have been good or bad. (ie better or worse than what actually happened)
There's nowt as strange as folks.
So true.
Hope this doesn't offend the religious persuasions of anyone on the list.. Regards Earl