- main - earth.li

Compiling backages for Debian-based distros
by Mark Rogers 05 Nov '07

05 Nov '07

I'm still trying to get my head around the correct way to configure a typical source tarball installation to fit into the Debian way of doing things. The best I've found so far is: ./configure --prefix=/usr --sysconfdir=/etc \ --sharedstatedir=/var --localstatedir=/var \ --libexecdir=/usr/lib Does all that look correct? The general idea is that if I want to try and build a replacement .deb for an existing package, using a more up to date source tarball, then I want all the files to end up in the same places as would have been the case for the original package. (For all the documentation I've found, the best so far was an answer to a similar question on a dbus mailing list: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/dbus/2006-September/005618.html) For the time being I'm only looking at i386 packages but I think the only thing that would change for 64-bit would be /usr/lib to /usr/lib64? -- Mark Rogers // More Solutions Ltd (Peterborough Office) // 0845 45 89 555 Registered in England (0456 0902) at 13 Clarke Rd, Milton Keynes, MK1 1LG

5 14

How should my hostname *really* be configured?
by Chris G 04 Nov '07

04 Nov '07

I have a CNAME record in the zone file at the hosting provider that hosts isbd.net so that home.isbd.net has the address 84-45-228-40.no-dns-yet.enta.net which is my home machine (via ADSL). So far so good, it all does basically what I want so that I can 'ssh home.isbd.net' and log in to my home machine and http://home.isbd.net in a browser gets to see the apache web pages on my home machine. However I still don't seem to have the 'local' setup fully sorted, i.e. how do I get things on my local intranet to work totally correctly? As it is things work but there are some 'infelicities'. In particular apache when it starts up has the message about "Could not reliably determine the server's fully qualified domain name ...." and I'd like to know the proper way to get the result of 'hostname' to be right. My home network is behind a router and most machines have static IP addresses in the 192.168.1 range, the router is set up to allow ssh and http through (with limitations). In my /etc/hosts file I have:- 127.0.0.1 localhost.localdomain localhost ::1 localhost6.localdomain6 localhost6 192.168.1.1 home home.isbd.net 192.168.1.5 garage 192.168.1.10 chris 192.168.1.40 netpr 192.168.1.44 hp7310 HPEDDBB7 HP000D9D068F7D 192.168.1.254 speedtouch Searching in google suggests that I need to add my proper hostname (i.e. home.isbd.net) to the 127.0.0.1 line in /etc/hosts but that sounds like it's incompatible with the 192.168.1.1 line. I want to end up in a situation where:- /bin/hostname returns 'home' (as opposed to home.isbd.net, so that my prompts and window titles are sensible) home.isbd.net is a valid address on my local network and connects to the linux server machine There are no complaints from apache (or others) at startup -- Chris Green

1 0

mount conundrum
by Chris G 04 Nov '07

04 Nov '07

Maybe I've got too involved in this and need to leave it for a while but I'll ask anyway..... A per the lvm thread I now have a whole new disk that has been lvm'ed. I think I probably want to move all my home directories and other such bits and pieces onto it. I.e. I will have one 'system' disk which has all the OS stuff on it and one 'data' disk which has home directories and anything else which is bascially data rather than programs (such as pictures, vmware guest images, etc.). So, how do I do it? If I create a /home directory on my root partition and then mount the new logical volume on /home it means that *everything* I create on that logical volume will appear as /home/<something>. That maybe alright for actual /home directories but doesn't make much sense for other stuff. Should I:- Split the new disk into more than one Logical Volume? Use lots of symbolic links? Stop drinking so much wine? I'm stopping now, doing things as root when I'm even slightly inebriated is probably not a good idea. :-) -- Chris Green

3 2

How to use pvcreate?
by Chris G 04 Nov '07

04 Nov '07

OK, so I have cleared everything off my /dev/sda (except, presumably, the MBR) and all is well still, Fedora still boots and my Windows guest virtual machine is still working. How do I now set up /dev/sda using LVM? As I understand it the sequence is to create a Physical Volume using pvcreate, then a Logical Group that uses the Physical Volumes I have created and then I create a logical volume in the Logical Group. The problem is that I don't understand how you tell pvcreate what disk it is to use. The 'synopsis' on the pvcreate man page says:- SYNOPSIS pvcreate [-d|--debug] [-f[f]|--force [--force]] [-y|--yes] [-h|--help] [-t|--test] [-v|--verbose] [--labelsector] [-M|--metadatatypetype] [--metadatacopies#copies] [--meta- datasizesize] [--restorefilefile] [--setphysicalvolumesizesize] [--version] [-Z|--zeroy/n] PhysicalVolume [PhysicalVolume...] Which doesn't seem to give much clue as to what disk it uses, PhysicalVolume is (as I understand it) the name that pvcreate gives to the chunk of disk you want to use, so what disk does it use? -- Chris Green

2 4

Some PDF printer jobs just hang (CUPS)
by Chris G 02 Nov '07

02 Nov '07

I have two printers on at home. both networked, an HP7310 which has its own network interface and an HP1320 which is networked via an old Axis print server. Most of the time they work fine with Word documents from Maxine's XP machine or my XP Vmware guest and documents from my Fedora box, etc., etc. However I'm having trouble printing some PDF documents, sometimes PDF prints OK and other times it just hangs leaving CUPS telling me that the job has been "Processing since ......". It even starts feeding paper on the HP7310, then stops. I *think* this may be on more complex printouts, e.g. when I have selected part of a PDF page to print but I'm not absolutely sure. Does anyone have any ideas what the problem might be? -- Chris Green

1 0

Show the BBC that more than 600 GNU/Linux users try to use their web sites
by MJ Ray 02 Nov '07

02 Nov '07

I think this below is a good idea. Please leave a comment saying how often you try to use BBC web sites (I forgot) and don't feel pressured into donating to the hosting company if you don't want to. To: london(a)lists.greenparty.org.uk, fsfe-uk(a)gnu.org Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:49:15 +0000 From: Tom Chance Message-ID: <5929a53b6c2c6514d68d6686dac25b0f(a)acrewoods.net> Subject: [Fsfe-uk] GNU/Linux users - sign petition to say you use BBC web site! Hello there, The BBC's head of technology is claiming that only about 400-600 people use GNU/Linux to access the BBC, as part of their PR excercise glossing over how badly they've got it wrong with their M$-only iPlayer (see http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/08/15/1721229 and for background see http://tom.acrewoods.net/blog/2007/aug/bbc-corrupted-iplayer-protests-uk) If you've used GNU/Linux to access the beeb, can you sign the petition below? Please circulate widely. http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/linuxbbc Kind regards, Tom _______________________________________________ Fsfe-uk mailing list Fsfe-uk(a)gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/fsfe-uk -- MJ Ray http://mjr.towers.org.uk/email.html tel:+44-844-4437-237 - Webmaster-developer, statistician, sysadmin, online shop builder, consumer and workers co-operative member http://www.ttllp.co.uk/ - Writing on koha, debian, sat TV, Kewstoke http://mjr.towers.org.uk/

1 0

Re: [ALUG] CSS problem
by David Reynolds 02 Nov '07

02 Nov '07

Matt, On 1 Nov 2007, at 10:19 pm, mephi wrote: > That's great thanks, I have one more question... > I want to put some kind of cell padding into the table > 'moduletable', as the > output on the page looks like: > > HomeNewsDev Blog > > And I'd like: > > Home News Dev Blog > > How would I add this in? I would do this by adding width to the td cells #headerMenu td { width: 200px; } You may want to fiddle around with the width to get the desired affect. Thanks, Dave -- David Reynolds david(a)reynoldsfamily.org.uk

1 0

CSS problem
by mephi 01 Nov '07

01 Nov '07

Ok, this isn't directly Linux related but I know that there are some very knowledgeable people out there. I've got some CSS code I'm having trouble with. I am building a template for a Joomla based site, and the output of one section looks like this: <div id="headerMenu"> <div class="moduletable"> <table width="100%" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="1"> <tr> <td nowrap="nowrap"> <a href="link1.php" class="mainlevel" id="active_menu">Home</a> <a href="link2.php" class="mainlevel" >News</a> <a href="link3.php" class="mainlevel" >Dev Blog</a> </td> </tr> </table> </div> </div> I've got the CSS for the headerMenu looks like this: #headerMenu { float: left; padding: 0px; margin-right: 0px; width: 941px; height: 26px; background: url(../images/AdellionMenu.jpg) no-repeat; font-family:arial, helvetica; font-size:12px; font-weight:bold; } What I want to do now is give a colour to the links within the table. I've tried: #moduletable{ mainlevel { A:link {color:#F7D4B6;} A:visited {color:#F7D4B6;} } } And: #moduletable.mainlevel { A:link {color:#F7D4B6;} A:visited {color:#F7D4B6;} } } And: #moduletable#mainlevel { A:link {color:#F7D4B6;} A:visited {color:#F7D4B6;} } } And: #mainlevel { A:link {color:#F7D4B6;} A:visited {color:#F7D4B6;} } None of which seem to work... Can anyone see where I'm going wrong? Matt

2 2

Apache access conundrum
by Chris G 01 Nov '07

01 Nov '07

I'm trying to restrict apache access to some areas of my home machine, so I have added the following sections to the httpd.conf file:- <Directory /var/www/html/chris> AllowOverride None Options None Order Deny,Allow Deny from all Allow from 192.168.1 193.128.168.194 AuthType Basic AuthName "ISBD Home Server" AuthUserFile /etc/httpd/conf/passwd Require valid-user Satisfy Any </Directory> <Directory /var/www/html/maxine> AllowOverride None Options None Order Deny,Allow Deny from all Allow from 192.168.1 193.128.168.194 AuthType Basic AuthName "ISBD Home Server" AuthUserFile /etc/httpd/conf/passwd Require valid-user Satisfy Any </Directory> The /var/www/html/maxine section works perfectly, I can access it without any hassle from home machines (192.168.1) and from work (193.128.168.194), plus if I access it from elsewhere I am asked for a password and, if entered correctly, I get access. However the /var/www/html/chris section doesn't work at all. From work I just get "You don't have permission to access /chris/ on this server." and from elsewhere I'm asked for a password but after entering the password I just get the 403 again. So what can possibly be the difference? The permissions down the tree from /home are the same for both. I'm stumped. Ah, *maybe* it's because it's looking for permission to view the directory at /var/www/html/chris, I'll check. -- Chris Green

1 1

"business as usual"
by ted.harding＠nessie.mcc.ac.uk 01 Nov '07

01 Nov '07

Hi Folks, Interesting read: http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2007/nov/01/microsoft.comment Best wishes to all, Ted. -------------------------------------------------------------------- E-Mail: (Ted Harding) <Ted.Harding(a)manchester.ac.uk> Fax-to-email: +44 (0)870 094 0861 Date: 01-Nov-07 Time: 13:21:13 ------------------------------ XFMail ------------------------------

1 0

Apache fell over
by Matthew 01 Nov '07

01 Nov '07

I'm running Apache 2.2.3 on Debian Etch. It generally runs happily and I haven't seen any issues since I upgraded the hosting several months ago, but at the weekend it died and I can't work out why. I have two things I was hoping people might be able to help with. /var/log/apache2/error.log includes: [Sun Oct 21 06:26:54 2007] [warn] child process 11300 still did not exit, sending a SIGTERM [Sun Oct 21 06:26:56 2007] [warn] child process 11300 still did not exit, sending a SIGTERM [Sun Oct 21 06:26:58 2007] [warn] child process 11300 still did not exit, sending a SIGTERM [Sun Oct 21 06:27:00 2007] [error] child process 11300 still did not exit, sending a SIGKILL [Sun Oct 21 06:27:01 2007] [notice] caught SIGTERM, shutting down The last row before that was from a week before, and shouldn't be part of the same incident. 6am is definitely not a peak time for this box. I couldn't find anything in any other logs that seemed relevant. Anyone got any idea what that was, or where I can look for more detail? Secondly, I really ought to have some mechanism to check on Apache (and MySQL) periodically and make sure they're running, either restarting them or alerting me (although I can be difficult to get hold of). What do people recommend for this? Is it as simple as having cron run a script to start the daemon if it's not already on the stored PID, or are there issues I should be wary of? Thanks, Matthew

6 5

Cambridge and East Anglian Python Users Group
by Richard Lewis 31 Oct '07

31 Oct '07

Hello ALUG, We held our first meeting of CamPUG last night and we have created a Google Group to help us collaborate. Please feel free to join: http://groups.google.com/group/campug Cheers, Richard -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Richard Lewis http://www.richard-lewis.me.uk/ JID: ironchicken(a)jabber.earth.li -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- +-------------------------------------------------------+ |Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments.| |http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html | +-------------------------------------------------------+

1 0

Email from cron scripts
by Mark Rogers 31 Oct '07

31 Oct '07

I have the following in my crontab: */5 * * * * /path/to/script.sh | mail -es "mail subject" me(a)example.com What "script.sh" does is check whether the mail server is running correctly. If it is, then it sends a message to stdout and exits. If it is not, then it sends a different message to stdout, then restarts the mail server, then exits. If the mail server is OK, the output to stdout is captured and emailed via cron correctly. If the mail server is not OK, it is successfully restarted but the mail does not get sent. In fact, the script never exits: $ps ax [..snip..] 28907 ? S 0:00 /USR/SBIN/CRON 28908 ? Ss 0:00 /bin/sh -c /path/to/script.sh | mail -es "mail subject" me(a)example.com 28912 ? S 0:00 mail -es mail subject me(a)example.com 28941 ? S 0:00 /usr/sbin/sendmail -i -FCronDaemon -oem root [..snip..] Clearly "mail" or "sendmail" (in my case the Postfix version) doesn't like the mail server being restarted under its feet like this. How can I get around this? I'd like to capture all the output from script.sh (including the output from the mail server restart) if I can. If it's relevant, in this case restarting the mail server means stopping (in this order) postfix, clamav and dspam, then starting them again in reverse order. The problem I'm having is dspam dies sometimes (once every couple of days) and the script is intended to work around this until I fix it. -- Mark Rogers // More Solutions Ltd (Peterborough Office) // 0845 45 89 555 Registered in England (0456 0902) at 13 Clarke Rd, Milton Keynes, MK1 1LG

5 6

Can one have different versions of the same plugin in Firefox?
by Chris G 30 Oct '07

30 Oct '07

Is it possible somehow to install more than one version of the same plugin in Firefox? I need a very specific old[ish] version of the Java plugin to run an Oracle applet, can I install this version *and* the latest version? N.B. the applet *doesn't* work with the latest version of the Java plugin, it looks for jpi-version=1.4.2_16 specifically before it will even try and start. OK, this is stupid but I can't do anything about it. -- Chris Green

4 4

Re: [ALUG] MS Office Publisher equivalent
by Stephen Dickinson Finance Assistant 30 Oct '07

30 Oct '07

Hi Rich, Thanks for that it will be really useful. I'm going to download Scribus and play with it awhile before I show it to the people who will be expected to use it. I'll also talk them through the process of changing files into pdfs and see how that goes, hopefully they don't have too many things that need converting, I think they work on a more ad hoc basis. When (and unfortunately it will be a 'when') I run into the kind of problem that just makes no sense, I'll be asking for your expert advice again! Thanks Steve Stephen Dickinson This email (including any attachments) is intended only for the recipient(s) named above. It may contain confidential or privileged information and should not be read, copied or otherwise used by any other person unless express permission is given. If you are not a named recipient, please contact the sender and delete the email from your system. It is the recipient's responsibility to ensure that appropriate measures are in place to check for software viruses.

2 1

SSH connections dying
by Mark Rogers 29 Oct '07

29 Oct '07

For a while I've been having a problem with some SSH connections to remote servers (OpenSSH client from Gnome terminal on Ubuntu desktop to OpenSSH server on remote server). Connection is fine, but at some point during data transfer the connection will die. It's always (as far as I can tell) during transfer of date from server to client, eg I'll do "ls" and get half a directory listing, then nothing. The connection doesn't close (it becomes unresponsive and I have to kill the terminal). Until now this has been annoying but not a show stopper; it happens fairly rarely. However, this weekend I'm at a LAN event talking to the server over a shared 3G connection (my PC -> IPCop -> Windows laptop with 3G modem and Windows Connection Sharing*) and the same symptoms are occurring, just far more frequently. All of which I think might give a clue as to what's wrong, but I can't work it out. Any clues? [*] 3G Modem comes with Windows software, this is the only way we could think to do this! -- Mark Rogers // More Solutions Ltd (Peterborough Office) // 0845 45 89 555 Registered in England (0456 0902) at 13 Clarke Rd, Milton Keynes, MK1 1LG

3 3

How to tell what extensions are installed without running Firefox?
by Chris G 29 Oct '07

29 Oct '07

This may seem to be a silly question, but...... I want to remember the name of an addon/extension I have installed on my home Firefox. I have ssh access to my home system. So, how can I tell what extensions are installed, I can't see any obvious clues in the $HOME/.mozilla/default hierarchy. It's not a sensible answer to run Firefox remotely, it'll take all morning to even start up across the internet connection from here to home. -- Chris Green

2 2

Books for library...
by Ruth Bygrave 25 Oct '07

25 Oct '07

Micromania (good jokey book about the early beginnings of home computing; brings back the full horrors of membrane keyboards, the original Adventure game, and the earliest user-hostile computers before Linux was even a gleam in Linus Torvald's eye) XSLT for dummies (spent hours hitting head on XSLT, failed. Yet another thing Adrian says is a good & useful language I couldn't learn) Osborne Complete Reference to Unix (1000s of pages, most of which no use to me) Discover Linux (Steve Oualline, almost certainly out of date) Danny Goodman's book on Javascript (vast; failed to learn it even with Dashcode to make it approachable) Unix Hints & Hacks (can't remember who wrote this) Beginning XSLT (Jeni Tennison, recent) Am keeping the Fish Book (bash) and my Applescript books as those are what I've written most in. If anyone wants those books for the library, yelp. I may even come back to them if I feel brave... Am not looking forward to lugging them to the meeting as some of them are 1000s of pages. Regards, Ruth

3 2

Books for library
by Ruth Bygrave 25 Oct '07

25 Oct '07

XSLT For Dummies (not for this dummy. Boyfriend says XSLT is just what I want, and I find it abstruse and impossible) Discover Linux by Steve Oualline The Complete Unix (incl Linux, Solaris, HP-UX) Unix Hints and Hacks (Que; haven't used this much) Beginning XSLT by Jeni Tennison (Good, but failed to learn XSLT from it, quite long) Micromania by Dave Langford (very short and jokey about 8-bit computers and hackers; will make you laugh if you remember those days; I do, just). Javascript, by Danny Goodman (absolutely enormous; failed to learn Javascript even with Dashcode to make it easy). These things can go in the ALUG library, and if I feel brave in a few years' time I'll prise open one of the covers... If anyone wants this doubtful heap, they can come over and pick it up, as I don't drive. I'm keeping the Applescript books (tight integration with Mac apps, and easy words) and the Fish Book (bash is good for really simple things), and determined not to go near anything that will scare me for a while. Ruth (...Linux drove me mad. Twice...) Bygrave PS. Historical accident: both times I decided to prod Linux and/or find out more about Darwin (OS X distro) were just before I fell into a deep depression. I need to keep the under-the-hood bits under the hood for a while.

1 0

MS Office Publisher equivalent
by Stephen Dickinson Finance Assistant 25 Oct '07

25 Oct '07

Hi everyone, I'm new to this list and have been enjoying reading it for the past week or so, everyone seems frighteningly clever so far though! I was just wondering if anyone could recommend a good open source equivalent of MS Publisher? I'm trying to persuade an office to move their two windows based PCs to Linux and have covered all the software so far except Publisher. Any suggestions would be gratefully received. Thanks Steve Stephen Dickinson This email (including any attachments) is intended only for the recipient(s) named above. It may contain confidential or privileged information and should not be read, copied or otherwise used by any other person unless express permission is given. If you are not a named recipient, please contact the sender and delete the email from your system. It is the recipient's responsibility to ensure that appropriate measures are in place to check for software viruses.

4 3

How to set font size in a java applet (in Firefox)?
by Chris G 24 Oct '07

24 Oct '07

Does anyone know how the font size is set in java applets? I run an Oracle forms java applet in Firefox at work and something has changed the font size so that it's too large. Column headings overlap each other and text in boxes is a total mess. It certainly *used* to work and I can't think of anything I have changed that would affect it but obviously something has. Changing the font sizes in Firefox's 'Preferences' has no effect at all. -- Chris Green

2 3

OpenDocument Foundation ODF da Vinci plugin ended
by samwise 23 Oct '07

23 Oct '07

Hi, For the open source activists on the list. We had a bit of a discussion on the use of ODF vs. MSOOXML in a corporate environment at the last Ipswich meet (more specifically, my ability to invoke a flame fest on the topic at work, without trying). I'm rather glad I didn't get too deeply involved in the debate - because I'm convinced now I'd've probably been on the losing side. ;) I'm not sure how widely it's been picked up, but I noticed yesterday that the OpenDocument Foundation's site [http://opendocument.foundation.googlepages.com/] has had a small note quietly appended. 'Note: All work on ODF da Vinci has ended. Without OASIS approval of our five generic eXtensions, known as the iX enhancements, we can not effectively convert existing Microsoft documents, applications and processes to ODF. The loss of fidelity and feature — business process specific information is too great. We are however able to make full, high fidelity "round trip" conversions to the W3C's CDF — meeting critical market requirements. If at some point in the future, the OASIS ODF TC does approve both our ODF iX enhancements, and, our "Universal Interoperability Framework Proposal", we will configure da Vinci to support both CDF and ODF iX.' Given this was the only MS Office plugin that was claimed would eventually provide a 100% perfect 'round trip' conversion fidelity, this sounds like a blow for ODF interoperability with MS Office and I think we're going to have to continue along in the era of document conversions mostly working, except for those tricky bits (i.e. anything involving tables or diagrams!). It's a shame - I'm big on promoting open standards but if the Massachusetts result didn't spell the end to ODF's challenge to MS Office, practically I think this might ... Peter.

3 3

Using VPN to provide static IP
by Mark Rogers 22 Oct '07

22 Oct '07

I have an application which needs to authenticate via an online server, and it must use a static IP to do it. I need to do it via a mobile connecting through a 3G connection, so static IP is out. The only way I can see to do this is to create a VPN (eg using OpenVPN) and connect the laptop to that, then make the connection through that. Since I'm not entirely sure how to do this, before I waste time trying it, can anyone give me a sanity check that this is the right approach? The only thing that worries me to start with is that I'm going into the VPN and out again; normally when I use a VPN it's to connect to a network, not use it as a gateway. -- Mark Rogers // More Solutions Ltd (Peterborough Office) // 0845 45 89 555 Registered in England (0456 0902) at 13 Clarke Rd, Milton Keynes, MK1 1LG

2 2

First Cambridge and East Anglia Python Meeting
by Richard Lewis 22 Oct '07

22 Oct '07

Dear ALUG, Following a very successful Python Conference UK[1] in September, a small group of us are attempted to set up a regional Python users group for East Anglia and Cambridge[2]. We have arranged to hold our first meeting on the evening of Tuesday 30th October at the Carlton Arms[3] (CB4 2BY). People intend to arrive from 19:00 onwards. I'll post any further details if they become available, otherwise feel free to contact me (on- or off-list) regarding this. Cheers, Richard [1] http://www.pyconuk.org/ [2] http://www.pyconuk.org/community/Cambridge_and_East_of_England [3] http://www.thecarltonarms.co.uk/ -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Richard Lewis http://www.richard-lewis.me.uk/ JID: ironchicken(a)jabber.earth.li -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- +-------------------------------------------------------+ |Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments.| |http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html | +-------------------------------------------------------+

1 0

Free Stuff
by David Reynolds 22 Oct '07

22 Oct '07

Hi, Been tidying up our spare room / office today and found a couple of bits that we don't need any more that are free to anyone who can come pick them up - Small 4 port hub thing - has 4 ethernet ports and one BNC port. I think it's only 10MB and has an American power supply with it, so would need an adaptor or replacement power supply http://david.reynoldsfamily.org.uk/stuff/hub.jpg - Micro ATX emachines case with DVD drive / CD Drive / Floppy Drive / Power supply - Please note this has no motherboard in it http://david.reynoldsfamily.org.uk/stuff/case.jpg Cheers, Dave -- David Reynolds david(a)reynoldsfamily.org.uk

2 1