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Alug library
by adam＠thebowery.co.uk 13 Jun '04

13 Jun '04

Hi all, Today I finally got around to updating the list of books that the Alug library has, the updated list can be found here http://www.alug.org.uk/contrib/?LibraryBooklist Adam -- jabberid = quinophex(a)jabber.earth.li AFFS || http://www.affs.org.uk/ || Not a filesystem

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European Elections
by John Seago 11 Jun '04

11 Jun '04

On Thursday we all have the chance, together with our families, friends and all those we can influence to vote in the European Election. Look here: http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~mikepitt/cambridge_politics/euro04.html Scroll down to the table that shows the previous results. It seems to me that if we made a concerted effort despite our own political convictions to vote UKIP we may be able to unseat the sitting Lib Dem! This will send message, very painful for the man, who will lose an income of about £75000 > £100000 and expenses, to the man, and the party, that due to their voting against our interests in the last parliament we have decided to vote against their interests in this election. This can be rammed home if he does get unseated by sending him, or the Lib Dems office an email telling them that those against Software patents worked to unseat a Candidate of the party that voted the 'wrong way'! Its brutal and unkind, but it will let Politicians know that we are a force to be reckoned with! -- John Seago Linux User #219566 (http://counter.li.org)

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Re: [ALUG] European Elections
by John Seago 11 Jun '04

11 Jun '04

On Wednesday 09 June 2004 00:35, BenEBoy <psychoferret(a)ukonline.co.uk> wrote: > But UKIP is a single issue group. If you don't agree with that single > issue then you shouldn't vote for them. In the grand scheme of > things, the UK withdrawing from Europe is more important than > software patents (*dons flame proof trousers*). People shouldn't vote > for UKIP just because they agree with *one* of their policies. Offered a choice between one Candidate I agree with 90% but not the last 10% on an issue on which I am campaigning, and another with whom I don't agree at all, except on that one point, where neither candidate is going to form, with others, a big enough grouping to have much effect, then I'll vote for the latter! > I'm sorry, but unless they election was *very* close, he's not going > to care at all. How many people would vote against him because of > patents? <100? <50? It's an important issue, but a minor one to most > voters. From what I've seen, heard and read, it might indeed be that close, if Andrew Duff loses by ONE vote, and then 200 voters tell him its because they worked to send a message on software patents and voting records, then both he, and the rest of his party who did get elected, are going to pay attention. -- John Seago Linux User #219566 (http://counter.li.org)

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Meeting report: City Gate Thursday 10 June
by Kirsten Naylor 11 Jun '04

11 Jun '04

A very convivial meeting; myself (wildduck), Adam (quinophex), Jonathan (Noodles), Elisabeth (sunflowerinrain), Brett (iDunno) and Graham. Great fun had by all! We were there from 8pm (latest arrivals around 9pm) till 11.30pm. Hopefully more faces next time - remember, second Thursday of the month at the City Gate. /Kirsten

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Meeting: City Gate, tonight, 8pm!
by Kirsten Naylor 10 Jun '04

10 Jun '04

We're all meeting at 8pm in the City Gate, as per http://www.alug.org.uk/meetings/2004/all-NorThu.html Directions can be found here http://www.alug.org.uk/venues/citygate.html See you all tonight :) /Kirsten

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Re: [ALUG] European Elections
by John Seago 10 Jun '04

10 Jun '04

On Thursday 10 June 2004 06:25, Adam <adam(a)thebowery.co.uk> wrote: > > Scroll down to the table that shows the previous results. It seems to > > me that if we made a concerted effort despite our own political > > convictions to vote UKIP we may be able to unseat the sitting Lib Dem! > > No, error, bad! wrong! European Parliament elections (AIUI) use a > proportional representation system and going by the results of the last > election is possibly not a good idea. So far I have read that many of > the main parties (especially Conservatives and Labour) are losing votes > to minority parties, so what everyone *must* do is vote, as every vote > for a party that isn't a main party means you make their share of the > vote smaller, at least then even votes for something scary like the BNP > will give the main parties less seats. So like Alan Cox said vote Green > or UKIP (personally I feel the UKIP has more against it than for it) or > one of the other minority parties, I don't suppose anyone knows Martin > Bells position on software patents? I do apologise if that was not what I wrote, I am taking rather a lot of prescription pain-killers lately and this has some effect on my abilities, (luckily the side effect is that I don't care). My intention was to make exactly the same point as Adam has. Even were I to re-read my original post, I know from past experience that I would only see what I meant to write. UKIP may not appear very attractive, however they do appear to be the front runners of the minor parties, but the real point is to VOTE, but NOT for the three big parties. When its political parties, is it party's or parties? -- John Seago Linux User #219566 (http://counter.li.org)

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Article on Open Source Telephony
by Chris Glover 09 Jun '04

09 Jun '04

Hi, I just got this from the Asterisk mailing list, thought it might be of interest to some. "Is open source IP telephony ready for prime time? Yes" by Zenas Hutcheson, St. Paul Venture Capital Network World, 06/07/04 http://www.nwfusion.com/columnists/2004/0607faceoffyes.html http://www.nwfusion.com/columnists/2004/0607faceoffno.html Enjoy Chris -- Chris ---------------------------------- E Mail: chris(a)glovercc.clara.co.uk SIP: 84411389(a)voiptalk.org IAXTEL: 17003366726

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Duplicates
by Anthony Anson 09 Jun '04

09 Jun '04

I keep getting duplicates from the list, is anyone else? It has to be this list because the last download only had mail from here. (If not I shall have to turn duplicate check off and wait...) -- Tony http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/ God sends the meat, the Devil sends the cooks.

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Norwich Internet Cafe
by Syd Hancock 08 Jun '04

08 Jun '04

(Sorry this isn't in the main thread) 1. This could be a perfect venue for some sunday afternoon meetings if that was OK with Lewis. Bandwidth, easy to get to, plenty of parking etc. 2. Is it time to think again about how often to have sunday meetings in Norwich? A year ago it was agreed to have them every three months so that meetings in other parts of the region wouldn't be stifled but apart from BJ at Syleham there haven't been many, if any, other w/e meetings. If we *could* use the Norwich Internet Cafe in the market on a sunday afternoon then how about every other month? Syd

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LibDems and software patents
by Alex Macfie 08 Jun '04

08 Jun '04

> > http://www.linux.org.uk/open.l.html> > /Kirsten> > Me too - thanks for the link - kinda summarises well what I've found out > so far, however on the wider scale of things I personally would prefer > voting Libdems who weren't mentioned there but I understand they are > also more receptive to our 'cause'. > > LibDem MEPs voted for software patents (ignoring party policy). For this they have come in for considerable criticism within the party. Full UK MEP voting data: http://www.ffii.org.uk/votes/swpat/country/UK.html Alex

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Re: [ALUG] Norwich Internet Cafe meetings?
by Brett Parker 08 Jun '04

08 Jun '04

On Mon, Jun 07, 2004 at 06:04:23PM +0100, Chris Walker wrote: > On Fri 30 Apr, Lewis Allen wrote: > > > > Thank you to everyone who took the time to comment on our offer of the > > Internet Cafe in Norwich Market as an additional venue for ALUG evening > > meetings. It would appear from the replies, so far, that a pub is still > > the much prefered venue. No matter, I am quite fond of beer too and often > > to be found in the Fat Cat sampling the Adnams. > > Adnams? You need to get out more ;-) The Fat Cat is about as out as you can get for good beer selection, obviously they're a die hard adnams fan, or not very adventurous ;) I don't think I've ever had the same drink on different sessions in the Fat Cat, wander in, pick something random from the vast selection, drink, if it's good stick to it for that session, if not, switch again and keep going till one that is good (doesn't usually take long ;) *grin* Ta, -- Brett Parker

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Norwich Internet Cafe meetings?
by MJ Ray 07 Jun '04

07 Jun '04

After http://lists.alug.org.uk/main/2004-May/018849.html, Craig seemed in favour of meeting at the internet cafe, but hadn't checked the place. No-one else has any opinion? -- MJR/slef My Opinion Only and possibly not of any group I know. http://www.ttllp.co.uk/ for creative copyleft computing Help hack the EuroParl! http://mjr.towers.org.uk/proj/eurovote/

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Reminder: Norwich City Gate meeting this Thursday night.
by Jonathan McDowell 07 Jun '04

07 Jun '04

As per usual, this Thursday (10th June) we'll be congregating in the City Gate from around 8pm. Full details can be found at: http://www.alug.org.uk/meetings/2004/all-NorThu.html J. -- jid: noodles(a)jabber.earth.li Eat a prune. Start a movement.

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Weekly IRC reminder
by Neill Newman 07 Jun '04

07 Jun '04

This is the automated ALUG IRC meeting reminder sent to remind you that there is an IRC meeting tonight (Monday) at 8.00pm. The meeting takes place on the irc server irc.alug.org.uk in the #alug channel. Most IRC clients should allow you to get there with the commands "/server irc.alug.org.uk" and "/join #alug". Popular IRC clients include tkirc, bitchx, xchat and EPIC on Unix, and Mirc under windows. Here are some links to help you get started with irc. Unix http://www.xchat.org/ http://freshmeat.net/ http://www.epicsol.org/ Windows http://www.mirc.com (loads of help with irc for newbies!)

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Gentoo is treating me better now
by Charles Garcia-Tobin 04 Jun '04

04 Jun '04

Hiyer everybody Gentoo is beginning to look great on my cube, I managed to download all the required sources, I have X with nvidia drivers working, nforce drivers working too. I do have a slight problem with disks though. When I boot the machine dma is turned off, and attempts to turn it back on are dissallowed thus: hdparm -d 1 /dev/hda /dev/hda: setting using_dma to 1 (on) HDIO_SET_DMA failed: Operation not permitted using_dma = 0 (off) Any ideas? is my IDE driver not quite right? Incidentally anybody know what I have to emerger to get lspci? Cheers for the help Charles

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Fwd: Re: Software patents
by Joe Button 03 Jun '04

03 Jun '04

Hi I thought I'd forward a copy of the email I just sent the Eastern MEPs to the list - I was in both a hurry and a blind rage when I wrote it so it's probably not me at my most coherent. Please let me know if there's anything obviously wrong with it. While I'm here, are people aware of this: http://swpat.ffii.org/papers/rms-cam020325/index.en.html Whatever you think of rms (personally I think he's a god and will defend his honour with my life) this is a great article about patents. Joe x ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Subject: Re: Software patents Date: Wednesday 02 Jun 2004 14:18 From: Joe Button <joe(a)joebutton.co.uk> To: rhowitt(a)europarl.eu.int Hello again. I'd just like to follow up my email with the information that Network Associates (a large american company) has just been granted a patent on various spam (junk email) filtering techniques in the US. By way of exploring the wisdom of software patents I would like to point out some of the implications of this: * One of the techniques the patent covers is 'Bayesian filtering'. The patent was applied for in December 2002. A very cursory search enabled me to find public discussion of Bayesian spam filtering from February 2002, which referenced material on the topic from dating 1999. * Another technique covered by the patent is apparently 'MD5 paragraph hashing', which simply means the creation of a shorter 'digital ID' code for a paragraph of text. I'm not a spam filtering expert, but as a reasonably capable programmer it seems to me that that is a blindingly obvious thing to do if you're trying to identify spam. * If I write a program that uses either the first established and public technique or the second extremely obvious one, I can be sued. In fact if I'd written one before the patent was granted or applied for I could still be sued. My options would be to get out of the spam-filtering business, to pay Network Associates for the right to use 'their' technology, or to launch a separate case to try to get the patent invalidated, which would be too costly and difficult for virtually any small business. * As an email user, I will be denied the use of free spam filtering software such as the popular 'spamassassin' as the distributors will not be able to license the technology. * Due to the decrease in competition that will be caused by this patent, spam filtering will be generally less efficient than it could be. The world will be a better place for spammers and Network Associates, and a worse place for the rest of us. According to the European Commission spam cost European businesses around two-and-a-quarter-billion euros in 2003 * It's also worth noting that many other spam filtering techniques are patented, some of them under patents that are so broad that they are simply widely ignored on the assumption they won't stand up to legal challenges. Contrary the UK rep's statement of support for de-revised text, permitting software patents will _not_ lead to a simplified legal situation, they will simply create a minefield for software developers and businesses. I hope this helps to clarify some of the implications of the impending legislative changes. Regards, Joe Button

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Re: [ALUG] Fwd: Re: Software patents
by Joe Button 02 Jun '04

02 Jun '04

On Wednesday 02 Jun 2004 17:22, IanBell wrote: > On Wednesday 02 Jun 2004 2:29 pm, Joe Button wrote: > > Hi > > > > I thought I'd forward a copy of the email I just sent the Eastern MEPs to > > the list - I was in both a hurry and a blind rage when I wrote it so it's > > probably not me at my most coherent. Please let me know if there's > > anything obviously wrong with it. > > Seems coherent enough to me but it has one flaw. What you are complaining > about, it seems to me, is the granting of an invalid patent because of > provable prior art. This situation has always been a possibility with > patents and is in no way unique to software. I did refer to prior art, but I thought I managed to winge about various other things as well, eg. the patenting of the blindingly obvious and the lack of remedy when patents are of dubious validity. Maybe I could have talked about the ways that software is a special case, but you there's only so much you can cram into an MEP's skull in one go. Really what I was trying to convey was that permitting patents on software created a restrictive and uncertain environment for businesses, in the hope of undermining the pro-unamended text lobby's position that it will increase clarity. Thanks for describing me as 'coherent' - I think that's probably the nicest thing anyone's ever said about me. Joe x

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Gentoo is running! but need to setup X
by Charles Garcia-Tobin 02 Jun '04

02 Jun '04

Hi there Gentoo is up and running, I have networking and everything. Once I'd mananged to download all the packages I needed it all wen't quite smoothly. I've done emerge --usepkg kde and similarly for gnome ( I can't decide!) but it did not setup X. It built it but there is no XF86Config. So is there a setup script like SaX2 on Suse that I can get things going? Another question is what I do to download MSFonts? Help appretiated Charles

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Re:
by John Seago 01 Jun '04

01 Jun '04

On Tuesday 01 June 2004 Steve Purkiss <steve(a)open4.org> wrote: > > I have had a real problem with understanding the voting on software > > patents and things, just completely unable to comprehend anything to > > do with it, until I read this open letter which I personally found > > very helpful, at least I know how to vote usefully now! > > > > http://www.linux.org.uk/open.l.html > > > > /Kirsten > > Me too - thanks for the link - kinda summarises well what I've found out > so far, however on the wider scale of things I personally would prefer > voting Libdems who weren't mentioned there but I understand they are > also more receptive to our 'cause'. > > Now I'm even more confused... Perhaps Mark will be able to let you have the voting results of the Lib-Dems on this matter in the European Parliament, I seem to remember something being mentioned about their voting record on this matter at Sunday's meeting. In the meantime perhaps you, (and every body else could send your candidates this: ___________________ I would be grateful if you could also reply to the following questions. Do you believe that current copyright enforcement measures are sufficient? Would you vote to allow technological measures that prevent duplication of copyright material for reporting, research and private study? Would you vote for future harmonsiations of European copyright laws to take a high level of protection as their basis? Do you believe that protection of copyright is more important than protection of competition? These questions concern the forthcoming second reading of the directive on patentability of computer-implemented inventions. Will you vote for freedom of publication (against patent program claims)? Will you vote for exclusion of data processing from a 'field of technology', as voted in Article 3a on 24 September? Will you vote for a definition of 'technical' by reference to forces of nature? Will you vote for rejection of the directive if it does not include all of the above freedoms, exclusion and definition? ______________________________________ -- John Seago Linux User #219566 (http://counter.li.org)

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Further to the discussion of software patents and the European parliamentary elections
by Kirsten Naylor 01 Jun '04

01 Jun '04

Hi all, I have had a real problem with understanding the voting on software patents and things, just completely unable to comprehend anything to do with it, until I read this open letter which I personally found very helpful, at least I know how to vote usefully now! http://www.linux.org.uk/open.l.html /Kirsten

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Odd bash error
by Chris Green 01 Jun '04

01 Jun '04

When I get an error message back from bash on this system it's prefixed by '-u', e.g. :- areti$ g -ubash: g: command not found It's not a disaster but it would be nice to fix it, any ideas anyone? I don't think it's a terminal type misconfiguration as the same type is working OK on other systems and I've also tried changing from rxvt to xterm which had no effect. Everything else seems fine. -- Chris Green (chris(a)areti.co.uk)

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New Member
by Ian P. Christian 31 May '04

31 May '04

Good morning all. I have been living in Ipswich for 2 weeks now, and I thought I should join the local LUG, so here I am! I'm currently working for an ISP in Ipswich. My website about sums up what I konw, and what I do. http://www.pookey.co.uk. Hope everyone enjoys the long weekend :) Kind Regards, Ian P. Christian

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Software Patents ...again!
by John Seago 31 May '04

31 May '04

At yesterday's meeting at Syleham, Mark gave us an update on the battle against software patents. He also gave us a list of questions that need to be put to all candidates for European Elections. The questions can be found here: http://mjr.towers.org.uk/proj/eurovote/#questions (you may have to scroll down to find them). Time is getting very short, the election is on the 10th June, and Mark needs the information well before then. All ALUGer's should be lobbying their candidates, I'm telling you this as Mark is far too polite to nag at you, but I'm not! -- John Seago Linux User #219566 (http://counter.li.org)

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Weekly IRC reminder
by Neill Newman 31 May '04

31 May '04

This is the automated ALUG IRC meeting reminder sent to remind you that there is an IRC meeting tonight (Monday) at 8.00pm. The meeting takes place on the irc server irc.alug.org.uk in the #alug channel. Most IRC clients should allow you to get there with the commands "/server irc.alug.org.uk" and "/join #alug". Popular IRC clients include tkirc, bitchx, xchat and EPIC on Unix, and Mirc under windows. Here are some links to help you get started with irc. Unix http://www.xchat.org/ http://freshmeat.net/ http://www.epicsol.org/ Windows http://www.mirc.com (loads of help with irc for newbies!)

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Evening meetings in Norwich Internet Cafe?
by MJ Ray 29 May '04

29 May '04

In reply to the recent announce message, Lewis Allen offered the Norwich Internet Cafe as a venue for evening meetings. He's also happy to announce and promote them. What do you think? ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: 2004-05-28 10:47:15 +0100 From: Lewis Allen <lewis(a)norwichinternet.com> Subject: Norwich Internet Cafe If you would like a venue for monthly ALUG evening meetings perhaps you would like to meet in our Internet Cafe in Norwich Market? A central Norwich location with 20 broadband screens, wireless access and CD writer which your members would be welcome to use for free (yes, free). We would only charge for any printing, blank disks, drinks etc. See www.norwichinternet.com for more about us. Why would we do this? I am interested in Linux and will be starting to learn PHP and MySQL soon and would like to do my bit to promote it's use in Norwich. Let me know if this interests you. Regards Lewis Allen Norwich Internet Cafe www.norwichinternet.com -- MJR/slef My Opinion Only and possibly not of any group I know. http://www.ttllp.co.uk/ for creative copyleft computing Help hack the EuroParl! http://mjr.towers.org.uk/proj/eurovote/

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