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Re: Future meetings
by Lucy McWilliam 04 Oct '01

04 Oct '01

Adam Bower wrote: > Is there any news on the next meeting (UEA people??) and possible venues > for future meetings? Are there any people interested in meeting up in Cambridge? I'm sure we could arrange something ;-) --------------------------------------------------------------------- Lucy McWilliam Email: lejm3(a)cam.ac.uk Flychip Tel: +44 (0)1223 765927 Department of Genetics Fax: +44 (0)1223 333992 University of Cambridge Mobile: 07939 476024 CB2 3EH WWW: www.bio.cam.ac.uk/~lejm3

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Audio HELL
by Ricardo Campos 03 Oct '01

03 Oct '01

I discovered some unruly audio aspects of my linux box; 1)In Nautilus, which I think sux btw (I want a file manager not a multimedia extravaganza), I accidentally put my cursor over about 4 or 5 MP3 files. I then had 5 MP3's playing *at the same time* for about 30 seconds. It was so bad I had to unplug my speakers. 2) Noatun crashed in an unbelievably cute way, and then the audio kept on playing. Is there a way of stopping this unruly sound daemon? Obviously I'm used to audio apps that kill the sound they produce when they die, but it seems Linux's renowned stability is backfiring! :) Ricardo, "Surely this monstrous hybrid comes not from a mother's womb but from an Ephialtes, an Incubus, or some other horrendous demon, as though spawned in a putrid and venemous fungus, son of Fauns and Nymphs, more Devil than man." -Athanasius Kircher, Mundus Subtarraneus, Amsterdam, 1665, pp.279-280 _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Re: [Alug] Audio HELL
by MJ Ray 03 Oct '01

03 Oct '01

"Ricardo Campos" <corez23(a)hotmail.com> writes: > Is there a way of stopping this unruly sound daemon? killall esd, apt-get remove esd and install alsa (but you really want 0.9.0 and it's still a pain to build just now). For less nasty solution, try man esdctl -- MJR I work for this clever Internet developer ==> http://www.luminas.co.uk/

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Nag-o-matic - future meetings
by Adam Bower 03 Oct '01

03 Oct '01

Hi people, I warn you now this sounds like a rant as the tone of the message got a little confused when I wrote it, but my intent is to encourage people to get involved, please don't flame me or think I am picking on you :-) Is there any news on the next meeting (UEA people??) and possible venues for future meetings? We are already in October and if we are to have a meeting this month then we really need to find a venue before the end of the week (we also need a date set so I can get motivated to get my a*se in gear and sort out the talk I am supposed to be doing on Debian) and it would be great if we could get November or Decembers meeting date/location arranged now. If you know of a possible venue for an Alug meeting then the requirements are basically enough room for ~30 people to sit and stand and generally mill around, some electrical outlets and some space for people to setup computers. Other nice but not essential things would be a bar and an internet connection. Also experience has shown that people are willing to help out with costs of hiring a hall etc. as long as its not more than a couple of quid each. We could still do with maybe a meeting in Cambridgshire or Essex, as we havn't visited these places yet. Finally if you do know of a venue but are a bit unsure of how to organise a meeting then others will help out, I would book something myself but I am a bit all over the place at the moment. Feel free to give me a shout if you need any specific help though. Hmmm, maybe time for me to sort out getting this kind of thing put in the FAQ. Adam PS if you are a lurker who knows of somewhere good we could go then please de-lurk now :-) -- This message is Copyleft - all rights reversed Adam

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(Scripting) languages
by tom potts 03 Oct '01

03 Oct '01

For Java there is (currently) a free 'RAD' called Forte (Community Edition) which seems pretty good but it uses a bit of resource. This can be run on Win32 or *nix etc etc. If you find java slow try looking for a jit compiler for you installation. Another 'tool' I've been playing with is the mysql/php on a web server. Not overly brilliant in the Maths dept but seems to run on most platforms. I'll be publishing an extendable GNU e-shop (before xmas I hope) built on mysql/php but using odbc to make it a bit more system independent. Haven't found any problems with it yet Tom ____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie

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VRML editors/tools for Linux
by Simon Jude 02 Oct '01

02 Oct '01

Hi, One of the geographical information systems that I use can export data such as digital elevation models to VRML. However, this facility is fairly crude and what I want to do is create a tour around around one of my elevation models using viewpoints and routes so that it can be used in a presentation that I am giving fairly soon. Not having the time to do this manually and learn how VRML works, is there any software for Linux that can do this sort of thing? Any ideas would be appreciated as I don't have a great deal of time!!! Simon School of Environmental Sciences, University of East Anglia, University Plain, Norwich, NR4 7TJ Web http://www.uea.ac.uk/~e931406/research

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Re: [Alug] (Scripting) languages
by MJ Ray 02 Oct '01

02 Oct '01

xsprite(a)bigfoot.com writes: > have you considered python? it's object orietated [...] As ever, except the bits which aren't. ;-) -- MJR I work for this clever internet developer ==> http://www.luminas.co.uk/

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Re: [Alug] (Scripting) languages
by Ricardo Campos 02 Oct '01

02 Oct '01

>have you considered python? it's object orietated, fairly simple and >"compiles" >into p-code whilst also is fairly portable. I have. Definitely one of the runners for this. Fairly as in can be d/l and used on a Win9x machine? At the moment I'm seriously considering Java, Python and TCl. Java seems most likely at the moment. >gui wise there's tkinter, wxWindows, >gtk, kde, and opengl. oh, and google is built on it. and that's just the search engine I'm using so much today! :) Many thanks for all the advice from all parties. I'll have to do a lot more reviewing of each candidate first. Ricardo _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Re: [Alug] (Scripting) languages
by MJ Ray 02 Oct '01

02 Oct '01

oms101(a)freeuk.com writes: > I dont know TK/TCL and it is a scripting language but I belive it > would do the job here, anyone with experiance of this frame work? It > is also I belive windows compatable And mac-compatible, last I saw. It is a very very simplistic language, but it is supposed to be fairly easy to use, though. -- MJR I work for this clever internet developer ==> http://www.luminas.co.uk/

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Exim Upgrade completed!
by Martyn Drake 02 Oct '01

02 Oct '01

Hi folks, Exim 3.33 is now up and running on the server and has been found to be stable enough to go live :) If you experience any problems with the lists over the next couple of days, please drop me a note and I will try and fix things as quickly as I can. Regards, Martyn PS. The only dislike I have about Exim is that in order for anybody to authenticate through SMTP AUTH with /etc/shadow support, you're going to need to use the pam_exim module available from http://www.e-admin.de/pam_exim/ as this is the only "secure" thing that will work other than to run exim as root.

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(Scripting) languages
by Ricardo Campos 02 Oct '01

02 Oct '01

I have just had the pleasure of writing a little script in VBS; it took me 30 minutes (including making some coffee) from looking at a webpage that included the syntax to actually completing it- this process would have taken me a day in C. (without having to learn it as well) Problem is, of course, the platform specificity. And of course the M$ link. I know there are various scripting laguages out there, but I really need a simple GUI driven non-script language that I can compile for *nix and win32 (urgh!). The reason for non-scripted is that I would like to use subroutines for common functions. It only needs to handle very simple mathematical calculations. (I'm writing handy calculators for players of a wargame, probably mostly window$ users, but I'm a *nix user, obviously, so it has to have support for us!) Java springs to mind, but it seems so PAINFULLY slow, even to do fairly simple stuff. If it was OO, that would be a bonus too. I suppose I'm just being a bit lazy; I could just compile a C program natively on 'nix AND win32. Potentially, I would like to add these separate elements into one larger program (this is where I would perhaps prefer C). I *WOULDN'T* like to pick up a new language as complex as C *YET*, at least not until I learn to use C properly. Any tips? For example, if you use Java, is there a nice free RAD/IDE for it? Anyone tried Kylix? (I have it on CD) Or maybe you could suggest another approach? Ricardo _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Re: [Alug] (Scripting) languages
by MJ Ray 02 Oct '01

02 Oct '01

Well, as you know, I'm a scheme fan and I think that GNU have definitely done The Right Thing in making a scheme their main extension language, although it's not perfect and is woefully under-used at the moment, even by official GNU software. Hopefully it can become as common as VB is on that other platform, as there's scope to do so much more with it. What we really need are more good libraries for guile and more good simple introductions to it. Teach Yourself Scheme in Fixnum Days is pretty good, though. So for the solution to the problem you have *now*, ie building cross-platform simple GUI non-C apps, I'd suggest taking a look at Visual Tcl, which should easily cope with having a few functions added. Sadly, the docs are rather thin on the ground, but it is basically Tcl behind the scenes, which is a fairly simple language. I think Java would be overkill for such a small app, but that's probably an equally good route, and I don't know Kylix well enough to comment. But I don't really understand why you think scripting means that you can't have functions. The distinction between a scripting language and a programming language is somewhat arbitrary these days. -- MJR This is my personal web site =-> http://mjr.towers.org.uk/ http://www.alug.org.uk/ <-- This is the LUG I go to I work for this clever internet developer ==> http://www.luminas.co.uk/

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Re: [Alug] (Scripting) languages
by flexifoil＠btinternet.com 02 Oct '01

02 Oct '01

[apologies using webmail!] > Java springs to mind, but it seems so PAINFULLY slow, even to do fairly > simple stuff. If it was OO, that would be a bonus too. Java isnt slow, and it gets my vote... > I suppose I'm just > being a bit lazy; I could just compile a C program natively on 'nix AND > win32. If you just want CLI, then thats easy. > Potentially, I would like to add these separate elements into one larger > program (this is where I would perhaps prefer C). I *WOULDN'T* like to pick > up a new language as complex as C *YET*, at least not until I learn to use C > properly. You could learn as you go... > Any tips? For example, if you use Java, is there a nice free RAD/IDE for it? > Anyone tried Kylix? (I have it on CD) Or maybe you could suggest another > approach? Borlands ? Andrew.

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Furby Linux :)
by Ashley T. Howes 01 Oct '01

01 Oct '01

http://www.trygve.com/furbeowulf.html Dr. Ashley T. Howes PhD www.ashleyhowes.com Programmer "When all the animals of this world are gone, man will die of loneliness"

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GPPP problems.
by Ricardo Campos 27 Sep '01

27 Sep '01

I'm now in a period of trying Gnome instead of KDE (bored so quickly!). Unfortunately, I can't get Gppp to work. It appears to be pointing to the correct device, has the correct phone #, correct IP& DNS settings etc. But it doesn't really get to that stage. I set up an account and it merely says "The ppp daemon died unexpectedly", which to a newbie like myself leaves bugger all clues except maybe that Gppp is somehow incorrectly interfaced with pppd ??? It feels like I've lost all my troubleshooting skills. Is there a log file that I'm missing somewhere, that could give me some clues? (and maybe I could then give more info to those who're helping me) Kppp works, but it's time to give Gnome a go methinks. It seems a little smoother performance-wise. Ricardo, _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Newbie question.... PATHS
by Ricardo Campos 27 Sep '01

27 Sep '01

OK, so I've symlinked Kgcc to gcc, but how does a program know where to look for gcc in the first place? Is it your 'path'? I'm saying this as I'm going to be compiling a Python prgram, but have had no experience in doing so. One of the prereqs is: "make sure Python is in your path". I guess that this is what an NT user would consider an environment variable? Or does it just mean that you have to be in the same dir. ? (seems unlikely) If it is a user env. variable, where is it to be found? ps. if I get my moop/doop running off dhs. you're all welcome to try it out. only 1 at a time, mind, cos the test box will be my home computer- all 46 kbps of bandwidth! whooosh! ;-D Ricardo _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Server maintenance: 1st October, 2001
by Martyn Drake 26 Sep '01

26 Sep '01

Hi, Just to let everybody know that these mailing lists will be unavailable for a short while during the day of the 1st October. I am upgrading to Exim from Sendmail and will need to verify the configuration for both local accounts and Mailman. Regards, Martyn

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1984: Linux not legal????
by Ricardo Campos 26 Sep '01

26 Sep '01

OK, my subject's a bit dramatic. But I think there are some serious issues relating to the new 'anti-terrorism' legislation, especially for those using SSH or *PGP. The UK RIP act is a favourite topic of mine, I'll spare you the rant, but you can check it out at: http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/ripa/ripact.htm or here (if you don't want to wade thru legal speak): http://www.cyber-rights.org/ (Main gripe: "Guilty until proven innocent" contravenes all agreed civilised standards of justice, and contravenes both the European and Universal Declaration of Human Rights - has anyone EVER forgotten their PGP password?) (oops, I said no rant! ;) Well, now the US is follwing suit with equally absurd legislation: http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/21830.html and a slightly more alarmist version: http://lwn.net/2001/0913/ God bless ambiguous legislation! ;) Ricardo (PS I know this isn't really technical, but it really isn't social either, and VERY pertinent to Linux) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Virtual window managers
by oms101＠freeuk.com 26 Sep '01

26 Sep '01

I am using IceWM, back in the past (before a period of KDE instability) I was a KDE fan, but today I feel that ice does all I need from a window manager, and does not use many resources. One think I have wanted to do for some time is start applications in other virtual windows than the virtual window that your window manager starts with in the .xinitrc file. anyhelp would be appresiated. Owen Synge Date: 26-Sep-01 Time: 10:10:11

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Re: [Alug] (k)gcc help?
by MJ Ray 26 Sep '01

26 Sep '01

"Ricardo Campos" <corez23(a)hotmail.com> writes: > Yup, I have made symlinks from kgcc/kg++ to gcc and g++. What is cc? cc is a generic name for the C compiler, still often seen on Sun kit until it has gcc, the GNU C Compiler, installed. > I'm trying to set up a MUSH (rather than a mud) for a friend, and it's a > nice little project for me. (Not that I have time outside of work at the > mo!) Have you seen moop and doop on sourceforge? They're quite interesting takes on the MOO concept (an OO evolution of MUSHes). -- MJR Thesis watch: 30% This is my personal web site =-> http://mjr.towers.org.uk/ http://www.alug.org.uk/ <-- This is the LUG I go to I work for this clever internet developer ==> http://www.luminas.co.uk/

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(k)gcc help?
by Ricardo Campos 26 Sep '01

26 Sep '01

Yup, I have made symlinks from kgcc/kg++ to gcc and g++. What is cc? I *have* compiled some programs now, there is only one I'm having real probs with (Pennmush >ftp.pennmush.org<), but I suspect it's not just my machine, one of the makefiles seems lacking (not that my C programming has yet to get to makefiles, more of the 'Hello World' level!)- at least that's what the compiler said. Perhaps the source ain't right? Is there a resource that gives a bit more help on the kind of errors gcc throws up (like error type [1], which seems non-fatal, or error [2] which seems to designate failure). I can debug my progs as they're dead simple, and *I* wrote them, but for other people's it's still a bit of a mystery. After 30 mins going thru the man pages I can't seem to find an exact resource to provide definitions or 'ball-parks' for these errors. saying that, the man pages are huge for gcc, so I may have missed them. I'm trying to set up a MUSH (rather than a mud) for a friend, and it's a nice little project for me. (Not that I have time outside of work at the mo!) Cheers, Ricardo _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Data cartridges - free!
by Edenyard 26 Sep '01

26 Sep '01

I'm sorry if this isn't the right place to post this message, but I don't know where else to go.... I have a quantity of DC600 and DC615 data cartridges that I need to dispose of. I once had plans to install a tape drive in my PC and use them, but it didn't work and, in any case, CD-RW seems to have overtaken us. What's available: 7 DC600, brand new still in selaed wrappers, 8 DC600, used, 14 DC615, used. They're completely FREE to a good home, but the only condition is that they have to be collected from me at Martlesham. If you'd like them or you know anyone else who would, please contact me at GDP(a)edenyard.co.uk - many thanks! Gerald.

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Contemplating Exim
by Martyn Drake 25 Sep '01

25 Sep '01

Hi folks, I'm contemplating using Exim as a replacement for Deadmail, and was wondering if there are any pros and cons associated with migrating everything on the existing server (including these lists) to Exim? I've had a bit of a play with it this afternoon and it's straightforward for me, but I don't want to suddenly find that I've run across a compatibility issue that may be lurking somewhere. Regards, Martyn

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Re: [Alug] Unresolved symbols
by MJ Ray 25 Sep '01

25 Sep '01

Paul <paul.corner(a)tesco.net> writes: > depmod -v appears to list all the symbols of each module visited. > Unfortunately, it still doesn't tel me which ones are unresolved - Or maybe > it does, and I don't know how to decipher the info. Aha! It's depmod -e, sorry. man depmod gives the right answers, as always. > I currently have about five different kernels on this machine, 2.2.18-rtx > through to 2.4.9-bifino - That really screws up any C source that depends on > specific kernel version info to build correctly <g> Well, surely as long as you point them to the right include directories it would make it possible, wouldn't it? It depends if you need them to run when they require particular information. -- MJR Thesis watch: 30% This is my personal web site =-> http://mjr.towers.org.uk/ http://www.alug.org.uk/ <-- This is the LUG I go to I work for this clever internet developer ==> http://www.luminas.co.uk/

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Re: [Alug] Strong case for text web browsers...
by tom potts 25 Sep '01

25 Sep '01

Sorry to disabuse you: the presence of a tag mentioning creation by FrontPage in web page merely means that at some time someone has looked at the site with FrontPage - its a true M$ product and would claim responsibility for anything. I have inadvertently used it to move a couple of files in a web site (it re-points urls to the pages you move) only to discover that the 16000 pages in the site were all created by frontpage (and all about 5 times the size as well!) Praise them for aiming at Lynx - all we need to do know is teach people how to use HTML properly. Tom ____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie

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