On Tue, 2005-07-05 at 22:05 +0100, Peter Onion wrote:
I do hope that the wrecklessness with which people are treating other peoples machines on the IRC channel at the moment doesn't result in the loss of anyones important data.
It's now 03:30 and I've just woken up realising what it was that I was really concerned about....
First off let me appologise to iDunno and quinophex if it seemed I was questioning their abilities to sort out wildfire_cs' problem.
While the experts amongst us would not give a seconds thought to using commands like cp /etc/fstab /etc/modules.conf . to back up some important files before editing them, consider this scenario from last nights IRC session
EXPERT: type "cp /etc/fstab ." [noob misses the "." off the end] NOOB: it said "cp: missing destination file"
now consider this slightly different scenario
EXPERT: type "cp /etc/fstab /etc/modules.conf ." [noob makes the same mistake and misses the "." off the end] NOOB: ok, what now....
Of course it becomes apparent only later that the the noob has overwritten their /etc/modules.conf with a copy of /etc/fstab. Not good !
So my not very well put point is that when "diving in" to help a new user to fix problems with their system, it is not always appropriate to tell them to do it the way you would do it yourself.
In last nights situation I think it would have been much better to suggest to wildfire_cs that they email a copy of /etc/fstab to either iDunno or quinophex, for them to then make the required changes and email back the changed file. wildfire_cs could then save the original and replace it with the edited version and bingo problem solved.
Adopting a strategy where the new user's scope for "cocking it up" is minimised has got to be the way to go. Consider the aftermath of a botched attempt to fix a problem.
NOOB: My XYZ super-mega-interface doesn't work now and it did before. NOOB: You've made it worse EXPERT: You must have typed the wrong command NOOB: I typed what you told me to type EXPERT: Stoopid Noob.... etc etc etc
If all they had to do was save an email attachment then run cp /etc/XYZ.conf /tmp cp saved-email-attachment /etc/XYZ.conf and it still broke, well it least you know it was your fault and the you should continue to try and fix their problem.
As I pointed out when Brett asked me when I first came across "/etc/fstab" I've been managing Unix boxes for about 20 years, and I was fixing peoples CP/M machines for a few years before that. If nothing else I've adopted a "anything that can go wrong will go wrong" attitude when telling people how to fix things (either over amateur radio,over the phone or via IRC) .
I would hate to see a helpful guru get their fingers burnt by some litegeous, clueless noob who asked for help then tries to sue for damages when the noob makes a mistake and screws up their own system.
When you see things like this Russian astrologer who is trying to sue NASA because their probe has upset the course of a asteroid and that has upset their "stars", you have to realise there are some real nutters out there and that you need to take extra care when offering assistance these days.
Peter O