What is the easiest way to get accented characters, specifically French, in apps running under KDE? In Open Office I can access them from Insert->Special Character but it is a bit long-winded. No idea how to get them in things like Kmail. Is there an equivalent of ALT+NumericKeypad codes, for example? Thanks Syd
On 28-Apr-04 Syd Hancock wrote:
What is the easiest way to get accented characters, specifically French, in apps running under KDE?
In Open Office I can access them from Insert->Special Character but it is a bit long-winded. No idea how to get them in things like Kmail.
Is there an equivalent of ALT+NumericKeypad codes, for example?
I think this generally depends on which application you are running, independently of whether you are using KDE (e.g. you can run kmail when not in KDE, for example on a remote machine using a different WM). A couple of examples: 1. Vim. This has a "digraph" option which can be switched on or switched off. When editing a file using vim, typing ^K (Ctrl-K) followed by two further keys gives you a character in the upper ASCII range of iso-8859-1. E.g. ^K-a-' gives you á (a-acute), ^K-c-, gives you ç (c-cedilla) and so on; ^K-1-2 gives you the "half": ½ . With vim in command mode, type ":digraph" to see what the letter-pairs are (sometimes not what you'd expect, e.g. you may find that a-circumflex is entered by ^K-a-^ or ^K-a-> ). 2. The mailer which I use (XFMail) has a similar mechanism only it uses ^D (as employed for the above special characters) instead of ^K. I've just had a look at kmail (old version, which I don't use) and there doesn't seem to be such a mechanism available in this version though I can't be sure. Sorry I can't help more. Agreed that "Insert->Special Character" is a time-consuming pain! (Maybe you can set up "keyboard short-cuts" though?) Best wishes, Ted. -------------------------------------------------------------------- E-Mail: (Ted Harding) <Ted.Harding@nessie.mcc.ac.uk> Fax-to-email: +44 (0)870 167 1972 Date: 28-Apr-04 Time: 07:47:40 ------------------------------ XFMail ------------------------------
On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 05:09:35AM +0100, Syd Hancock wrote:
What is the easiest way to get accented characters, specifically French, in apps running under KDE?
In Open Office I can access them from Insert->Special Character but it is a bit long-winded. No idea how to get them in things like Kmail.
Is there an equivalent of ALT+NumericKeypad codes, for example?
I do quite a lot of E-Mail and Newsgroups in French so I've fought my way through this problem over several interfaces.
On 2004-04-28 08:59:20 +0100 Chris Green <chris@areti.co.uk> wrote:
Fromconsole (i.e. text mode) applications the usual method for producing accented characters is to use the 'compose' key. This is a generic X method too.
This is good. Turn your right Windows key into compose with: setxkbmap -option compose:rwin -- MJR/slef My Opinion Only and possibly not of any group I know.
On Wednesday 28 April 2004 09:36, MJ Ray wrote:
This is good. Turn your right Windows key into compose with: setxkbmap -option compose:rwin
That is a REALLY neat idea, best use I have seen for those stupid keys yet. I would do it right away myself, except that after considerable time searching I now have a new keyboard sans stupid Microsoft keys. For those who wish to acquire the same, you have basically two options (aside the lovely but very expensive Happy Hacker and other specialist keyboards) Locate an IBM type M keyboard (there are companies remanufacturing these I think) or order a replacement keyboard as a spare part for any recent Compaq/ HP server, they are really quite nice and are available in White or Black I went for the Compaq/HP as I never particularly got on with the old style IBM keyboards or the noise they make whilst in use.
Being very lazy here in not bothering to look thru the documentation, but is there a way modififying my .Xmodmap file to get the same effect as: setxkbmap -option compose:rwin I already have some keyboard map modifications and I'd really like that compose too. Cheers Charles On Wednesday 28 April 2004 19:01, Wayne Stallwood wrote:
On Wednesday 28 April 2004 09:36, MJ Ray wrote:
This is good. Turn your right Windows key into compose with: setxkbmap -option compose:rwin
That is a REALLY neat idea, best use I have seen for those stupid keys yet.
I would do it right away myself, except that after considerable time searching I now have a new keyboard sans stupid Microsoft keys.
For those who wish to acquire the same, you have basically two options (aside the lovely but very expensive Happy Hacker and other specialist keyboards)
Locate an IBM type M keyboard (there are companies remanufacturing these I think) or order a replacement keyboard as a spare part for any recent Compaq/ HP server, they are really quite nice and are available in White or Black I went for the Compaq/HP as I never particularly got on with the old style IBM keyboards or the noise they make whilst in use.
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On 2004-04-28 18:38:31 +0100 Charles Garcia-Tobin <charles@garciatobin.plus.com> wrote:
Being very lazy here in not bothering to look thru the documentation, but is there a way modififying my .Xmodmap file to get the same effect as:
No. I could explain why, but laziness is contagious. Please be unlazy enough to reply beneath trimmed quoted material next time. -- MJR/slef My Opinion Only and possibly not of any group I know. http://mjr.towers.org.uk/ http://www.ttllp.co.uk/ for creative copyleft computing
On Wednesday 28 April 2004 21:43, MJ Ray wrote:
On 2004-04-28 18:38:31 +0100 Charles Garcia-Tobin
<charles@garciatobin.plus.com> wrote:
Being very lazy here in not bothering to look thru the documentation, but is there a way modififying my .Xmodmap file to get the same effect as:
No. I could explain why, but laziness is contagious. Please be unlazy enough to reply beneath trimmed quoted material next time.
Actually you can, it turns out that simply adding keycode 116=Multi_key turns your right Windows key into the compose. I got the keycode number using xev, and I would recommend anybody using this method to double check their keycode with xev. I suppose it should be the same but I dunno for for sure. Incidentally if you have fancy buttons on your keyboard using xev you can find out their keycodes and then assign them to Function keys in your .Xmodmap simply adding lines like keycode <number>=F30 Once they are mapped to mundane functions keys, you can enter them as keyboard shortcuts on any KDE/GNOME app.
On 2004-05-02 23:46:39 +0100 Charles Garcia-Tobin <charles@garciatobin.plus.com> wrote:
Actually you can, it turns out that simply adding keycode 116=Multi_key turns your right Windows key into the compose. [...]
No, that is not the exactly the same effect as setting the XKB map correctly. Configuring XKB correctly should be the number 1 choice, if at all possible, IMO. By the way, if you are using a keyboard with lots of extra keys, you may find that your BIOS complains instead of generating keycodes. Updating the BIOS usually(!) fixes it. -- MJR/slef My Opinion Only and possibly not of any group I know. http://mjr.towers.org.uk/ http://www.ttllp.co.uk/ for creative copyleft computing
On 2004-05-03 12:42:38 +0100 Syd Hancock <syd@toufol.com> wrote:
How is that done? Is configuring XKB different from creating/modififying the .Xmodmap file?
XKB is usually configured by the Keyboard section of your XF86Config. I pasted my section to the list recently, IIRC. You can change XKB config while running using setxkbmap. -- MJR/slef My Opinion Only and possibly not of any group I know. http://mjr.towers.org.uk/ http://www.ttllp.co.uk/ for creative copyleft computing
On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 06:01:33PM +0000, Wayne Stallwood wrote:
I now have a new keyboard sans stupid Microsoft keys.
Heh, the one Microsoft product I really like is the Natural Keyboard, On a desktop I wouldn't use anything else if I could help it :) Adam -- jabberid = quinophex@jabber.earth.li AFFS || http://www.affs.org.uk/ || Not a filesystem
On Wednesday 28 April 2004 17:43, adam@thebowery.co.uk wrote:
Heh, the one Microsoft product I really like is the Natural Keyboard, On a desktop I wouldn't use anything else if I could help it :)
I had one of those at a previous job and really liked it, then one unfortunate day it suffered a spill. I quickly ordered a replacement, when it came it was some some sort of 'revised' version with strange sized arrow keys and the Page up/Page down Ins/del and home/end all in the wrong place.... Couldn't get on with the new one at all. Now I have moved back to a more traditional keyboard shape. In my job I spend lots of my time using other peoples machines so having to adjust from/to the natural keyboard was doing me in.
On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 09:55:40PM +0000, Wayne Stallwood wrote:
some some sort of 'revised' version with strange sized arrow keys and the Page up/Page down Ins/del and home/end all in the wrong place....
Yeah, they did do that, it was a bit annoying when I had one type at home and the different type at work, they also changed the key action which was really annoying.
Couldn't get on with the new one at all. Now I have moved back to a more traditional keyboard shape. In my job I spend lots of my time using other peoples machines so having to adjust from/to the natural keyboard was doing me in.
I still use lots of different keyboards it doesn't bother me to use a different keyboard at all really, the main reason I use the natural keyboard is that it causes me less pain in my hands (althought since I started taking glucosamine and chronditron I can even use totaly useless keyboards and I don't get pain in my hands, although crap mice can cause pain) Adam -- jabberid = quinophex@jabber.earth.li AFFS || http://www.affs.org.uk/ || Not a filesystem
You need to have a 'compose' key, this is a matter of setting up your keyboard map to assign 'compose' to some fairly easy key combination. On my Linux box at home I have it set to 'Shift Alt Gr', on my Sun box at work there is actually a Compose key.
Many thanks for the info. Following Mark's suggestion I have looked at man pages and googled for setxkbmap but I think I need some help here! Is there a simple setxkbmap command to get the above key assignment (I don't have a windows key on this keyboard)? Or any other simple recommended method? Syd
On Thu, Apr 29, 2004 at 05:53:41AM +0100, Syd Hancock wrote:
You need to have a 'compose' key, this is a matter of setting up your keyboard map to assign 'compose' to some fairly easy key combination. On my Linux box at home I have it set to 'Shift Alt Gr', on my Sun box at work there is actually a Compose key.
Many thanks for the info. Following Mark's suggestion I have looked at man pages and googled for setxkbmap but I think I need some help here!
Is there a simple setxkbmap command to get the above key assignment (I don't have a windows key on this keyboard)? Or any other simple recommended method?
At home on my Linux system there I have assigned the compose key to the shifted 'Alt Gr' (I think), if no one else responds before this evening send me a reminder and I'll check out my setxkbmap settings there. -- Chris Green (chris@areti.co.uk)
On Thursday 29 April 2004 05:53, Syd Hancock wrote:
You need to have a 'compose' key, this is a matter of setting up your keyboard map to assign 'compose' to some fairly easy key combination. On my Linux box at home I have it set to 'Shift Alt Gr', on my Sun box at work there is actually a Compose key.
Many thanks for the info. Following Mark's suggestion I have looked at man pages and googled for setxkbmap but I think I need some help here!
Is there a simple setxkbmap command to get the above key assignment (I don't have a windows key on this keyboard)? Or any other simple recommended method?
Syd
I just tried Mark's suggestion (setxkbmap -option compose:rwin) and to my great pleasure it worked. I then found another useful command: dumpkeys --compose-only (that's double minus in front of 'compose') which lists all your current compose settings. So for example, the French é is done by <compose> e ' and è is done by <compose> e ` where the last one is the backtick on the top left of most keyboards. It makes no difference if you type the letter before or after the accent. Now to hope the above survives the trip to the list and back.... -- GT
On Thu, Apr 29, 2004 at 11:39:01AM +0100, Graham Trott wrote:
On Thursday 29 April 2004 05:53, Syd Hancock wrote:
You need to have a 'compose' key, this is a matter of setting up your keyboard map to assign 'compose' to some fairly easy key combination. On my Linux box at home I have it set to 'Shift Alt Gr', on my Sun box at work there is actually a Compose key.
Many thanks for the info. Following Mark's suggestion I have looked at man pages and googled for setxkbmap but I think I need some help here!
Is there a simple setxkbmap command to get the above key assignment (I don't have a windows key on this keyboard)? Or any other simple recommended method?
Syd
I just tried Mark's suggestion (setxkbmap -option compose:rwin) and to my great pleasure it worked. I then found another useful command:
dumpkeys --compose-only (that's double minus in front of 'compose')
which lists all your current compose settings. So for example, the French é is done by <compose> e ' and è is done by <compose> e ` where the last one is the backtick on the top left of most keyboards. It makes no difference if you type the letter before or after the accent.
Now to hope the above survives the trip to the list and back....
Yes, I get your é and è OK. Only those who have a display which can show ISO-8859 characters correctly will see them though. -- Chris Green (chris@areti.co.uk)
On 2004-04-29 11:39:01 +0100 Graham Trott <gt@pobox.com> wrote:
dumpkeys --compose-only (that's double minus in front of 'compose')
Looks very useful, but doesn't work in utf-8 yet, sadly. Thanks for letting us know, though. -- MJR/slef My Opinion Only and possibly not of any group I know. http://mjr.towers.org.uk/ http://www.ttllp.co.uk/ for creative copyleft computing
Thanks for all the feedback - I'll have to have a good look all this at the weekend. What little I did find out is that in Mandrake (9.2 and possibly others) the compose key is the AltGr key. The command xmodmap -pke dumps a listing of all the keycodes and the results of using alone, with shift, with compose and compose+shift. I directed the output into a file for study so for example I have: keycode 10 = 1 exclam onesuperior exclamdown which gives (if you can see them!) the following four characters: 1 ! ¹ ¡ or: keycode 47 = semicolon colon dead_acute dead_doubleacute giving é for < compose ; e > which is different from Graham's example. However I have for the first time counted how many keys are on the keyboard - 102 - and will now try editing the XFConfig-4 file (which is set for pc105 - I've never really thought about it before), restarting X and starting again. Syd
On Thursday 29 April 2004 05:53, Syd Hancock wrote:
Is there a simple setxkbmap command to get the above key assignment (I don't have a windows key on this keyboard)? Or any other simple recommended method?
Syd
Some more beavering around came up with some more key definitions you might want to try. Look in /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/xkb/README.config and /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/xkb/rules/xfree86.lst and for some more background go to http://www.redhat.com/archives/redhat-list/2003-November/msg00378.html -- GT
On 2004-04-29 05:53:41 +0100 Syd Hancock <syd@toufol.com> wrote:
Is there a simple setxkbmap command to get the above key assignment (I don't have a windows key on this keyboard)? Or any other simple recommended method?
I think (but am not sure) that Compose = Shift+AltGr is the default for a GB pc105 keyboard, so you just use no options for that. For XFree86 4.x and derived: Section "InputDevice" Identifier "Keyboard0" Driver "keyboard" Option "XkbModel" "pc105" Option "XkbLayout" "gb" EndSection I have a hacked up gb layout file in order to put some accented chars on AltGr+char. Ĝis! -- MJR/slef My Opinion Only and possibly not of any group I know. http://mjr.towers.org.uk/ http://www.ttllp.co.uk/ for creative copyleft computing
Some more things that may be interesting: XKEYCAPS http://www.jwz.org/xkeycaps/
xkeycaps is a graphical front-end to xmodmap. It opens a window that looks like a keyboard; moving the mouse over a key shows what KeySyms and Modifier bits that key generates. Clicking on a key simulates KeyPress/KeyRelease events on the window of your choice. It is possible to change the KeySyms and Modifiers generated by a key through a mouse-based interface. This program can also write an input file for xmodmap to recreate your changes in future sessions. <<
Also, in KDE, look at Kmenu->Configuration->KDE->Accessibility->Keyboard Layout->Options tab - there are options for compose key here amongst several others. ¥ée! Syd
On Fri, Apr 30, 2004 at 06:58:40AM +0100, Syd Hancock wrote:
Some more things that may be interesting:
XKEYCAPS http://www.jwz.org/xkeycaps/
xkeycaps is a graphical front-end to xmodmap. It opens a window that looks like a keyboard; moving the mouse over a key shows what KeySyms and Modifier bits that key generates. Clicking on a key simulates KeyPress/KeyRelease events on the window of your choice. It is possible to change the KeySyms and Modifiers generated by a key through a mouse-based interface. This program can also write an input file for xmodmap to recreate your changes in future sessions. <<
Ah, xkeycaps, that was the program I was trying to remember when I sent my mail to you about xmodmap. -- Chris Green (chris@areti.co.uk)
participants (8)
-
adam＠thebowery.co.uk -
Charles Garcia-Tobin -
Chris Green -
Graham Trott -
MJ Ray -
Syd Hancock -
Ted.Harding＠nessie.mcc.ac.uk -
Wayne Stallwood