jo@yee-ha.demon.co.uk, Monday, October 14, 2002 10:16 AM
David Cartwright wrote: <many fine, well reasoned arguments>
Bravo, that man.
Ditto. For me Naomi Klein's No Logo <http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0006530400/qid%3D1034588688/202-4792728-7548655> sums up many of my causes for concern about MS (and other big corporates) but David is right, sometimes they produce good products and, as professionals(?), we should always use the best (in our own judgement) tools for the job in hand and trying to put our personal prejudices aside. Keith
Keith Watson wrote:
jo@yee-ha.demon.co.uk, Monday, October 14, 2002 10:16 AM
David Cartwright wrote: <many fine, well reasoned arguments>
Bravo, that man.
Ditto.
For me Naomi Klein's No Logo <http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0006530400/qid%3D1034588688/202-4792728-7548655> sums up many of my causes for concern about MS (and other big corporates) but David is right, sometimes they produce good products and, as professionals(?), we should always use the best (in our own judgement) tools for the job in hand and trying to put our personal prejudices aside.
Agreed. I've seen far too many instances of projects where IT people who love MS just go straight for the MS solution - because its MS and everything else they have is MS, and MS took them for a great round of golf+beers last time.... Neil (err, writing this on WinXP because UT2003 won't run on linux on my aged TNT2...)
Keith Watson <Keith.Watson@Kewill.com> wrote:
[...] sometimes they produce good products and, as professionals(?), we should always use the best (in our own judgement) tools for the job in hand and trying to put our personal prejudices aside.
I think the question is, really, what weighting do you give to the practical benefits of the four freedoms, and do ethics matter when deciding what is the "best" tool? Is it purely a technical scoring decision and to hell with ethical as long as the job gets done? Does your reasoning hold only for computing, or for other things? Do you recycle? Do you use sustainable energy sources? Do you bank with someone who funds arms sales? Where is your pension money invested? etc... UEA actually seems to have quite a good tradition in considering ethics in places where others do not, even if it sometimes takes a little prompting for TPTB to wake up. Maybe just a little prompting is needed again? MJR
We're currently thinking that instead of trying to rush things together for friday (thats when Microsoft are due), and instead of starting a pro/anti microsoft debate, I just want to know what we can do to promote free/open source software, perhaps holding an event in a few eeks / months's time after some serious planning? J
We're currently thinking that instead of trying to rush things together for friday (thats when Microsoft are due), and instead of starting a pro/anti microsoft debate, I just want to know what we can do to promote free/open source software, perhaps holding an event in a few eeks / months's time after some serious planning?
is this something we can discuss at Sylham on the 3rd? Keith ____________ Each of us must journey through the dots, beyond the dots, and to the truth, alone. Russell Hoban
Keith Watson <Keith.Watson@Kewill.com> wrote:
[...] sometimes they produce good products and, as professionals(?), we should always use the best (in our own judgement) tools for the job in hand and trying to put our personal prejudices aside.
I think the question is, really, what weighting do you give to the practical benefits of the four freedoms, and do ethics matter when deciding what is the "best" tool? Is it purely a technical scoring decision and to hell with ethical as long as the job gets done? Does your reasoning hold only for computing, or for other things? Do you recycle? Do you use sustainable energy sources? Do you bank with someone who funds arms sales? Where is your pension money invested? etc...
UEA actually seems to have quite a good tradition in considering ethics in places where others do not, even if it sometimes takes a little prompting for TPTB to wake up. Maybe just a little prompting is needed again?
Yes, good point. But how about the ethics of the brief from whoever you're working for? i.e. if your employer (or whatever) doesn't specifically require you to apply such considerations should you? or perhaps one should provide a number of possible solutions among which are those that take such considerations into account? Also there is the point that we, in theory, have the choice of not accepting any brief that doesn't accord with our own ethical stance. I must admit that I would feel uncomfortable working directly for an arms manufacturer or similar but I have worked for pharmaceutical companies in the past and I'm not always happy about everything they do but there are other activities where I am. In his book "The Empty Raincoat" (also published as "The Age of Paradox") Charles Handy discusses this at some length and points out that there can be circumstances where ethical considerations conflict with each other e.g. the difference between what's 'just' and what's 'fair'. Keith ____________ Is there life before death? - Zen saying
participants (4)
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James Edward John Taylor -
Keith Watson -
MJ Ray -
Neil Sedger