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Announce digest, Vol 1 #2 - 1 msg
by announce-request＠lists.alug.org.uk 02 Sep '01

02 Sep '01

Send Announce mailing list submissions to announce(a)lists.alug.org.uk To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/announce or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to announce-request(a)lists.alug.org.uk You can reach the person managing the list at announce-admin(a)lists.alug.org.uk When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Announce digest..." *** Please send replies to main(a)lists.alug.org.uk, not announce... *** oMMMoMo Mo MMMMMMMoMo " "o"o"o"o oMMMoMoM oMMMMMM"MMM" " " " " " "o"o "oMMMoMMM " oMo"M"oo MM" " MoMoMMMMMMM oM " " "oMMM " " MoMMMMMoMoMoooo Mo MMM MoMoMMMMMoMMMMM o" MoM " MoMM "MMo"oMoMMMoM"" MM " MMMMo MMMMMoMMMMMM" oM " MoMMM MMMoMMMo"MM Mo" "MMoMo ooMMMMMMMoMo" oMo oMoMMM " "oMoMMMoMoMo MoM oMoMMM MMMMMMMMMoMMM "oM oMoMMM "M"M"MMoMMMo" " o "oo " MMMM" MMMMMoMoM o" " "oM " " " "o MMMoMMMo"o M " oM " " MMMMMMMoMo o" "oMoMoooMo" " o " " MMoMMMoMoMo " "o"o MM"""""""oM oM " "MMo oMMMMMoMMMoMo " """ """ " o"MMMMoMMMoMMMo"MMo"o" o o o oo MMMMMMoMMMoMMMoMoMo MMMMM MMMo oMMM MMMo MMoMMM oMoMMMoMMMoMMMoMMMo"o oMMMMM MMMo oMMM "MMo MMM "MM MMMMMMMoMMMMMMMoMMMM" " " MMo"MMo MMMo oMM" MMMo oMM" """ " MoMMMoMMMoMMMo" " " MMMoMMMo MMMo oMM" MMMo oMM"oMoMo " "MMoMMMoMMM " " MMMMMMMo MMMo oMM" MMMo oMM" "MM oMMMoMoMoMMMoMMMoMo" " oMM" "oMM" "MMMMM" "MMMMM" MMMoMM" ooMMMMMMMoMMMMMMMoMMMoMo "M" " " " " " """ """ "oM """oMM" " " "MMoMMMoMMMoMM" " " " " " " " alug-announce : The Newsletter of the Anglian Linux User Group Today's Topics: 1. Best of ALUG (end of August) (MJ Ray) --__--__-- Message: 1 To: announce(a)lists.alug.org.uk From: MJ Ray <markj(a)cloaked.freeserve.co.uk> Organization: Cat-killingly bad Date: 02 Sep 2001 10:16:45 +0100 Subject: [Alug Announce] Best of ALUG (end of August) Here's this month's 2nd edition... Topics: [Alug] Syleham poster 4 u Re: [Alug] Announce ALUG 2001.5 [Alug] Announce ALUG 2001.5 [Alug] Linux Expo Birmingham re-scheduled from 12th-13th september 2001 to [Alug] LPI Certification Re: [Alug] SSH/SCP No Password [Alug] Friendly Offer ? Re: [Alug] Security problems (was Lurkers) Re: [Alug] Disk Space for Linux Re: [Alug] Meeting report? [Alug] Getting data out of databases ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 24 Aug 2001 15:47:18 +0100 From: MJ Ray <markj(a)cloaked.freeserve.co.uk> Subject: [Alug] Syleham poster 4 u Initial details of the syleham meeting should be on the website. A poster to be scattered around liberally is at http://mjr.towers.org.uk/alug/syleham20016.pdf ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2001 23:38:56 +0100 (BST) From: "D.I. Redhouse" <dir21(a)cus.cam.ac.uk> Subject: Re: [Alug] Announce ALUG 2001.5 On Thu, 23 Aug 2001, John Woodard wrote: > Announce ALUG 2001.5 > > The next meeting of ALUG (Anglian Linux User Group) will be on Sunday 16th > September 2:00 - 6:00pm at Syleham and Wingfield Village Hall (Mid Suffolk > venue). Venue details at http://www.alug.org.uk/venues/syleham.html If nobody's got any objections I was planning to bimble along to this. So it seems only polite to say that since I have a nice fast connection and more CD burners than you can shake a stick at: if anybody wants CDs of ISOs that they can't get down a modem or whatever, I'll make them up and bring them along if you let me know what exactly you want (within reason, like). Oh, and another thing. On the website at: http://www.alug.org.uk/articles/2001a/alugfaq.html it says: `It can be installed alongside another OS (such as MS Windows or (i think?) Mac OS)' ^^^^^^^^^^ You can definitely dual-boot with MacOS, although I'm not entirely sure how easy it is to install Linux alongside an existing MacOS installation that already uses the whole disk. If you see what I mean. - - David Redhouse, Department of Archaeology, University of Cambridge 0787 6372962 dir21(a)cam.ac.uk http://www.arch.cam.ac.uk/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2001 19:14:15 +0100 From: "John Woodard" <mail(a)johnwoodard.co.uk> Subject: [Alug] Announce ALUG 2001.5 Announce ALUG 2001.5 The next meeting of ALUG (Anglian Linux User Group) will be on Sunday 16th September 2:00 - 6:00pm at Syleham and Wingfield Village Hall (Mid Suffolk venue). Venue details at http://www.alug.org.uk/venues/syleham.html I will of as ever volunteer to organise this meeting and any future Mid Suffolk meets. If enough people want it I might be able to get the bar opened for the afternoon so make your requests now. The promotion of the meeting via Usenet can be left to me I will do it ASAP so if there are any news groups you think would be an appropriate place to advertise let me know in the past I have announced meets to: uk.comp.os.linux alt.local.east-anglia comp.os.linux.announce (local:) and the pcplus.linux news groups are there any I have missed? If you are coming mail me with what kit you are bringing and any requests for help and we will get it put up on the web site as before. Cheers, BJ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 19:39:36 +0100 (BST) From: Adam Bower <abower(a)thebowery.co.uk> Subject: [Alug] Linux Expo Birmingham re-scheduled from 12th-13th september 2001 to 29th 30 th May 2002. (fwd) Hi all, Just got this mail in my inbox, so it is now on for May. I think we will organise an outing a bit nearer the time. Adam - -=20 This message is Copyleft - all rights reversed Adam - --------- Forwarded message ---------- Subject: Linux Expo Birmingham re-scheduled from 12th-13th september 2001 to 29th 30 th May 2002. Dear Visitor, Thank you for registering for LINUX EXPO BIRMINGHAM. Please note that the show has been RE-SCHEDULED from 12th-13th September 2001 to 29TH-30TH MAY 2002. The show will still take place at the NEC and will have exactly the same focus, dedicated to GNU/Linux and Open Source Solutions. There is no need to register again - we will re-register you automatically for the 29TH-30TH MAY 2002. Apologies for any inconvenience caused by re-scheduling the show. We look forward to seeing you in May for a high-quality show! Yours Sacha Dunas CEO Sky Events / Linux Expo T=E9l : 0143456600 Fax : 0143459244 Portable : 0672802604 Email : sacha.dunas(a)sky-events.com Linux Expo 2002 Amsterdam - 19 - 20 February Paris - 30 - 31 & 1 February Madrid - 3 - 4 April Sao Paulo - 15 - 16 May Birmingham - 29 - 30 May Milan - June Sky Events 12 avenue de Corbera 75012 Paris ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2001 23:01:36 -0400 From: John Seago <john.seago(a)btinternet.com> Subject: [Alug] LPI Certification There was a query raised as to the costs of the Linux Professional=20 Institute Exam. Details can be found at :- http://www.lpi.org/ I understand the costs are $100 US for the Exam and a registration=20 fee. The nearest Exam centres are reported to me as being at Ipswich=20 and Peterborough. John Seago=20 (I've got the time to browse!) ------------------------------ Date: 19 Aug 2001 12:56:06 +0100 From: MJ Ray <markj(a)cloaked.freeserve.co.uk> Subject: Re: [Alug] SSH/SCP No Password "D" <dsc(a)clara.net> writes: > Anyone ever got this to work? Not sat down and tried yet but a guy I was > talking to yesterday said its harder then it looks, surely you just need the > host keys etc.. and your away. I have eval $(ssh-agent) quite early in my .xsession file. This makes sure everything in my X session knows where to find the key manager. Then using ssh-add lets me add keys to it. You generate ssh keys with ssh-keygen and have to copy the right one to the target machine's $HOME/.ssh/authorized_keys file. Other than that, it's fairly simple... ask questions if you want more than the manual pages say. I even have a VPN using slip over ssh, for when I need to appear to be on an internal network somewhere. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2001 10:37:26 +0100 From: "Martyn Ashworth" <martyn.ashworth(a)eag.uk.com> Subject: [Alug] Friendly Offer ? All, I have got a copy of Kylix (Open Source) that I will gladly burn onto a CD for anyone interested (or who do not have the bandwidth to download 28Mb). All you then have to do is register to play with an awesome RAD tool for Linux. Sys Requirements: RedHat >= 6.2 Mandrake >= 7.2 SuSE >= 7.0 175Mb Free HD Space. Just e-mail me the postal address (mailto:martyn.ashworth@eag.uk.com) and i can get it sent out in the post tonight. Martyn ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 15:33:21 +0100 From: xsprite(a)bigfoot.com Subject: Re: [Alug] Security problems (was Lurkers) on Fri, Aug 24, 2001 at 03:13:15PM +0100, MJ Ray scribbled: > MJ Ray <markj(a)cloaked.freeserve.co.uk> writes: > > > Can someone clue me in on how MITM attack would work here? > > Key stroke analysis even. http://www.openwall.com/advisories/OW-003-ssh-traffic-analysis.txt It's quite fun looking at a certain stream and guessing what the user is doing. One long burst normally indicates a full screen editor/program. Regular short updates tend to imply something like a progress bar (wget, bsd ftp). And as the paper says, single characters, sometimes typed quite quickly, sometimes slowly (because passwords can be complex to type), that are not echoed back, tend to be passwords. Surely the echo control should be on the client side. Anyhow. > > I'm probably just hard-of-thinking this morning. > > Yes, you are, aren't you? hehe, it would seem soo.. :) ------------------------------ Date: 15 Aug 2001 08:42:54 +0100 From: Andrew John Savory <a.savory(a)btinternet.com> Subject: Re: [Alug] Disk Space for Linux On 15 Aug 2001 08:41:44 -0400, John Seago wrote: > We would like to know what is the optimum size for one Linux distribution, as > the Mandrake I have currently installed takes up a little over 2 gigabytes, > (in a 5.5 gigabyte partition), how much more space do they needed over the > the actual programme itself? How long is a bit of string? The amount of space needed depends heavily on what it is you're doing with the machine. I've got a debian firewall using 300mb of a 2gb drive... but a debian desktop machine using every spare byte of 4gb... a debian server that has cheerfully chewed through the best part of 40gb... > There would also seem to a problem with the rest of my rather elderly > computer recognising the whole of the 40 gigabytes, it seems to be able to > `see' only 33 gigabytes of the new disk. I've got a P133 that's able to see the entire partition of a 34gb disk (only one partition on there). It has to be slave though, as it's linux that can see the disk and not the machine itself (I can't boot off it). Good luck with the experiment, anyway, Andrew. - - a.savory(a)btinternet.com All views are my own - who else would want them? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Aug 2001 11:49:50 GMT From: David Freeman <david_freeman(a)alug.org.uk> Subject: Re: [Alug] Meeting report? On Mon, 13 Aug 2001 11:21:16 GMT Martyn Drake wrote: > Okay, spill the beans - how did yesterday's meet go? :) > > Regards, > > Martyn Having managed to give Mark 125MB of email since 7pm yesterday I think its now safe to post a report. Well My worst fears didn't occur as I got a phone call from Mark at 1pm "Where are you" "getting cash out of a cash point which is giving me a DHCP error" replies I. Once I arrive I get a call from Andrew "I'm at tesco's how do I get to you?" which was duely sorted. 8 people turned up including Steve Fosdick Mark Ray Syd Hancock Neill Newman Andrew Glover Peter Holness Peter Clarke and me. We got the cd-writter and sound working on my new debian install and discovered why I couldn't install netscape. Other than that it was a typical meet with lots of chocy biscuits and stilulating conversation on various subjects. Notable by absence BJ Jen Jo Earl Tarquin So who wants to do the next one? Thanks D ------------------------------ Date: 11 Aug 2001 20:05:31 +0100 From: MJ Ray <markj(a)cloaked.freeserve.co.uk> Subject: [Alug] Getting data out of databases I'm the secretary of an association and responsible for keeping their membership lists. As a Linux user, it seemed natural to me to keep the membership records in a database and along the way I discovered two applications which make life very much easier for the non-programmer. PostgreSQL is the database that I use, mainly because I like to have all the features available and I have never had any stability problems with it. For database design and data entry, I discovered the handy pgaccess application which presents an interface not dissimilar to a more famous program with a similar name. The notebook window which is displayed when you start up has tabs for Tables, Views, Forms, Queries and so on, while each one contains a list of available items and some actions on them. Once the command "CREATE DATABASE members;" had been given at the psql command line, it was simply a case of inputting the database details into pgaccess's "Open Database" window to be able to start entering the information. pgaccess was downloaded as part of PostgreSQL, available from ftp.postgresql.org/pub and its home page is at http://flex.ro/pgaccess/ The report generator of pgaccess is not yet finished, so I was left with the problem of how to get the data out. I usually use LaTeX for writing letters and reports, so I was quite happy to discover the GNU Report Generator, gurgle, which was originally designed to work with that. To use it, you write a short gurgle script which includes a few definitions, the database query and the template for outputting the data to another file. Here's my script to print envelopes: %%define PHYSDB "members" %%define NAMCOL %%define TEXEXT .tex %%database "members.sql" select name, institution, mailaddress from memberdetails %%header %%record \envelope{%NAME \\ %INSTITUTIO \\ %MAILADDRES} %%footer %%end The first line sets the database name to connect to, the next tells gurgle to use the names from the query, the third says to save the file with the .tex extension, then we have the query. An empty header and footer surround the record template, which simply puts the database results in a call to my "envelope" macro with some line breaks. The file is then included into my envelope printing file (which also contains the association's logo, etc) and any small changes (replacing commas in the address with line breaks, for example) are done before sending the file to the printer and generating a stack of printed envelopes for a mailshot. Gurgle can be downloaded from http://www.gnu.org/directory/GURGLE.html or http://www.dai.ed.ac.uk/homes/timc/gurgle/ and has optional modules for GNUSQL, PostgreSQL, MySQL and CA-Ingres databases as well as text dump files. Comments? Improvements? Your alternatives? --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Announce mailing list Announce(a)lists.alug.org.uk http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/announce End of Announce Digest

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Re: Crying wolf
by John Seago 01 Sep '01

01 Sep '01

I was up until now more than a little wary of anything that involved the command line or Text editor, as I have no idea what I'm doing. However as I've decided that every thing has to come off the first disk in order to re-install windows on it's own disk where I can ignore it, (and it and all the Email's I collect every so often, and the files I can't do without will be safe from ill informed experiments in linux, which sometimes have a backlash), I'll have a go, after all I'm going to reinstall everything. Thank you so much for your suggestion, I'll try in the morning when my first dose of painkillers lend extra, baseless confidence, (overconfidence really). John

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Re: [Alug] About ntlworld in Norwich area.. coming soonish
by brodders＠cwcom.net 01 Sep '01

01 Sep '01

?? I take it that's via a BT line Owen? How do you access ntl? I'm a C&W customer with a C&W phone line. ntl bought them out late 1999 - I've had an ntlworld acount since um March 2000 but it just does not connect; I try every few months and the old C&W exchange refuses the ntl dialup number saying "the number you have dialled has not been recognised". ntl have said that the old C&W exchange will have to be upgraded before ntlworld is available & the C&W kit does support ntlworld. No, this isn't broadband stuff - plain old V.90! Perhaps it'll be V.92 if the upgrade really is new. Snag is, the way I read it the old C&W email I use is going to die - I hate changing my main email address about. Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: <oms101(a)freeuk.com> To: <brodders(a)cwcom.net> Cc: <main(a)lists.alug.org.uk> Sent: Friday, August 31, 2001 4:38 PM Subject: RE: [Alug] About ntlworld in Norwich area.. coming soonish > I have got ntlworld access already (except it was down all mornig due to a > lightning strike) its just the broad band service thats coming soonish I thought > > Owen > > > On 30-Aug-01 brodders(a)cwcom.net wrote: > > Re a thread weeks ago about Cable & Wireless customers in Norwich finally > > getting > > ntlworld acces... this was in my mailbox today: > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > Some time ago you registered for our internet service ntlworld and we thank > > you for your patience. During this time, we've been working to upgrade our > > network > > to deliver the service in your area and we're delighted to inform you that > > we'll <<big snip >>

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About ntlworld in Norwich area.. coming soonish
by brodders＠cwcom.net 01 Sep '01

01 Sep '01

Re a thread weeks ago about Cable & Wireless customers in Norwich finally getting ntlworld acces... this was in my mailbox today: Dear Sir, Some time ago you registered for our internet service ntlworld and we thank you for your patience. During this time, weve been working to upgrade our network to deliver the service in your area and were delighted to inform you that well soon be able to give you ntlworld. ntlworld will be provided to replace your current internet service (please see below for details). ntlworld the free unmetered internet service from ntl offers you five email addresses, webmail, webdiary, 10MB of web space, ten content channels and the ntl web directory (your easy reference to more than a million websites). On top of that, extensive on-line help will be available to you. Theres also a 24 hour Technical Support Line if you need to call us (calls are charged at £1 per minute). To receive ntlworld you dont need to do a thing. Within the next few weeks we will send you an email telling you when you can expect to receive your installation CD. You dont need to contact us, as we have your details and we have no further information about delivery dates at present. Upon receipt of the CD, you must install it before 31st October 2001. Important changes to your current internet service Following our acquisition of the retail assets of Cable & Wireless Communications Services Ltd, Cable and Wireless agreed to continue to manage your current internet service on our behalf until the 30th November 2001. As this agreement is coming to an end, we regret to inform you that your current internet service will not be available after the 30th November 2001. However by this date, youll be able to access ntlworld, which we hope will minimise any inconvenience this may cause. If you decide not to take up our offer to receive ntlworld, you will need to make alternative arrangements for your internet service from the 30th November 2001. Tariff changes for Connect customers If you are a Connect customer and decide to take up this ntlworld offer, you will automatically be migrated to the standard ntl call plan tariff*. This tariff offers a simple 3-2-1 pricing structure for local and national calls: 3p a minute weekdays, 2p a minute weekday evenings and 1p a minute at weekends wherever you call in the UK. This gives you: National calls at local rates, allowing you to call all around the country for the same price as calling next door. Unlimited Free offpeak Talktime** to other ntl cable telephone customers in your local call area. Access to an International Call Plan*** option with low international rates, such as 5p a minute to Australia, New Zealand, USA, Canada and many more. All calls have a 4.9p connection charge. Once again, thank you for you patience, and we hope you will take full advantage of this opportunity to enjoy the benefits of ntlworld. Yours sincerely, Jane Lockyer Head of Customer Relationship Management Ref: L018 *This migration is as a result of standardising our network following our acquisition of the retail assets of Cable & Wireless Communications Services Ltd. Whether you decide to take up the ntlworld internet offer or not, your telephone tariff will change with effect from 30th November 2001. A further communication to Connect customers will follow prior to this date. The 3-2-1 tariff applies to local, regional and national calls only including all calls from Northern Ireland to the Republic of Ireland. Separate tariffs apply to other calls including non geographic calls. All calls are subject to a 4.9p connection charge. **Free Talktime applies to calls from your ntl residential telephone to friends and family who are also ntl residential telephone customers and live in the local call area, from 6pm to 8am during the week and all weekend. All calls are subject to a 4.9p connection charge. Excludes calls to access Internet service providers. For details of local call areas please call Customer Services. ***International Call Plan subscription charge of £2 per month applies. Terms and conditions apply: http://www.ntlworld.com/legals/user-policy.htm All services are subject to contract and availability in your area. ntlworld is only available to residential customers who are 18 or over. Calls to ntl call centres may be monitored for training purposes. Information is correct at time of going to print 08.01. ntl Group Limited Registered Office: ntl House Bartley Wood Business Park Hook Hampshire RG27 9UP Registered in England and Wales No.2591237

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Slight DNS fu
by markj＠cloaked.freeserve.co.uk 01 Sep '01

01 Sep '01

Hi all, alug.org.uk has had some DNS problems. Martyn assures me that all will be fine soon. Thanks for your patience during this difficult time. ;-) Talk to you soon, MJR

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Re: [Alug] diald
by MJ Ray 30 Aug '01

30 Aug '01

Raphael Mankin <raph(a)panache.demon.co.uk> writes: > I had no trouble with diald. The advantage of using it, over cron, > is that the itnerface appears to be there at all times, even if it > is not active. Using cron to change your filter on ppp0 (which is there all the time pppd is running) has the same effect.

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Crying Wolf
by Earl Brannigan 30 Aug '01

30 Aug '01

Hi John > Subject: [Alug] Crying Wolf > I would be grateful however if > someone can hazard a guess at why the programmes on my first hard > drive seem to be either self destructing or slowly dieing, a bit at a > time? A stab in the dark : I had a similar problem once where I had 64Mb of memory installed and Linux 'thought' I had 128 Mb installed. View /etc/lilo.conf and check for : append = "mem=XXX" where XXX is a value representing how much memory is installed, eg. if you have 128MB of memory the line should read : append = "mem=128M" if it reads more than you have then you have a problem anyway, regardless of whether this is the cause of this particular problem (As Linus Torvalds puts it "Bad things will happen"). The Linux Kernel addresses up to 64Mb of memory by default so up to that amount you should be safe (though I do remember reading somewhere that its always safer to specify exactly how much even if less than 64Mb). If you have >64Mb installed but there is no line in lilo.conf you will only address the 1st 64Mb. So you would need to add a line to address the full memory : Here is a dump from mine : ---------snip----------- boot = /dev/hda timeout = 50 linear prompt default = linux vga = normal read-only map=/boot/map install=/boot/boot.b image = /boot/vmlinuz-2.2.19.0 label = linux append = "mem=128M" root = /dev/hda1 ---------snip----------- The " append = " bit is merely passing the value as a parameter to the kernel at boot time. Hope this helps anyway, will continue to rack brains for other possible causes... Regards Earl

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Re: [Alug] diald
by MJ Ray 30 Aug '01

30 Aug '01

Raphael Mankin <raph(a)panache.demon.co.uk> writes: > diald lets you control *when* connections are made. It also provides som > filtering to prevent the connection from being raised for various classes of > traffic. If you replace 'anyreason' by 'little reason', however, I agree with > you. I think all the filtering and timing can be controlled by cron, connection scripts and ipchains/iptables with pppd. It's not such a one-stop-shop, but it is more widely used and stabler, in my experience. I just remember diald being hell to get working. I'm not sure it ever did work correctly for me. Not used it again since, so maybe they've updated it.

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Crying Wolf
by John Seago 29 Aug '01

29 Aug '01

Please ignore last plea for help, I ran the install disk in rescue mode, and while I have no idea what I was doing I managed to get it to work again. This is either very good luck, or very good work on the part of the original programmers. I would be grateful however if someone can hazard a guess at why the programmes on my first hard drive seem to be either self destructing or slowly dieing, a bit at a time? John

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Further developments/failures
by John Seago 29 Aug '01

29 Aug '01

Matters seem to go from bad to worse, having restarted I find that the linux, (Mandrake 8), on disk one has now lost its < file:/usr/share/applink-mdk/XXXXXXXX > the effect is that all thelaunch icons on the panel are now inactive, while those on the desktop still work. Can I as someone who has yet to be able to work the command line mend it, or would it be easier to re-install? john Seago

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