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Re: [Alug] ALUG Library ...
by MJ Ray 04 May '01

04 May '01

David Freeman <david_freeman(a)rocketmail.com> writes: > So this would be what owen was saying about PHP on sunday about content > and markup being mixed together, Whilst I can see some of these evils, > doesn't CSS attempt to help? Oh, many of us will have a go at PHP for that. CSS doesn't really help much, as you still have most of your program code stuffed in a servable document rather than kept right away from your markup. There are ways to remedy it a little, but it's better not to have the problem there in the first place, eh? -- MJR

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Re: one thread, three holy wars was Re: [Alug] ALUG Library ...
by MJ Ray 04 May '01

04 May '01

"Mark Wilkinson" <mark(a)wiggis.com> writes: > I think it best to program it in raw assembler and store the data on a 1.44 > floppy in EBCDIC. I prefer to put the data there by inductions from an unshielded spark plug. How about you? [...] > whacked on a linux box in say... a couple of hours. :-O Am I missing > something here? Is the objective a programming exercise or to get a library > system running? I'm quite happy to use one of the other systems, but it's not my decision. The debate about tools etc is generally interesting to people working or wanting to work with the web, I think. -- MJR

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Re: [Alug] Internet ready computer systems GBP195
by MJ Ray 04 May '01

04 May '01

User banned from this list. Complaints filed with ukonline, ic24 and the Metropolitan Police. Fun. Please no-one bother with his advert, as it's a fairly bad price for the equipment and he clearly has no clue or ethics, posting here. -- MJR

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ALUG Library ...
by brodders＠cwcom.net 04 May '01

04 May '01

HALLO THE GROUP Ahem. Hi all.. After discovering the ALUG at the UEA last Sunday - I've been volunteered into getting something going for the O'Reilly books ALUG (via David) now hold. I wanted to borrow the book on MySQL and mSQL - so :) I have been asked to write a system. Oh No! Who me? Me Steve. Me much too much to do (tax, company returns, commuting, 2 houses to buy, holiday someday) but then I want to explore MySQL. Two aspects - 1. The System We Want We've some books (6) a) do we want more? How will be get them? b) do we want to loan other resources (CD's, hardware etc)? c) do we want to loan private as well as ALUG stuff? (perhaps an option) d) do we want a central repository or do things wander around? e) Factor X - the unspoken expectation coming to haunt me later. All the above shape how the database will be designed, data lifecycles & that sort of stuff. Ideas Appreciated, especially if they reduce work. [Only? :) ] 2. Practicalities a) Don't want to put effort into something not used... so start small. b) IF it's to be web based, we'll need a host service supporting MySQL - do we have this?? c) Me No Web Wizard ! d) IF not web based - um, how's it going to work?? e) it's getting late & I've not had my UT fix yet. Anyone want to give a hand / interested in getting something going? Bye! Steve PS will post some more thoughts re design & features a bit later.

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Internet ready computer systems GBP195
by tony.liquids＠ukonline.co.uk 03 May '01

03 May '01

Branded PENTIUM Computer systems with Internet , only �195 Hi You don't need an expensive new computer to type letters, look after household finances, enjoy the Internet, keep a database or familiarise the family with computers. We are disposing of 'second user' branded computers, which were once amongst the best you could buy. Now one can be yours for only �195 complete and there is no VAT to be added. The Desktop computers have Windows 95 and Word Processing, Database, and Spreadsheet loaded and running. For a small extra you can 'Surf' the Internet or send E-mails. Why spend �1000 or more on the latest computer with tricky gizmos that you won't use and will require a "rocket scientist" to get going ? I trust the following will answer your questions in time for you to quickly reserve a 'second user' branded computer whilst we still have some left..... * Branded Pentium 75 Computer (16 RAM, Min 360Mb Hard Drive) * Colour Monitor (14" Super VGA) * Keyboard and Mouse (new) * Windows 95 (loaded and running with online instructions and help) * Microsoft Works (Word Processor, Spreadsheet, Database all loaded and Running) Only 195 Pounds Door to door delivery (FREE if you E.mail your order and pay by cheque) Add �24.50 You can choose any of these optional extras...... * Freeserve Internet Software and new super fast 56K modem installed and ready to send e-mails and surf the Internet FREE * CD ROM (Min 44 SPEED, new) Add �48.00 * Colour Printer (new, including cartridge and cables) Add �79.00 Your computer will arrive in just 14 to 21 days. Your computer will include all cables, guidance notes and a 30 day return to base guarantee which ensures the above applications. You will also receive two independent help lines. You can simply plug in your computer and start using it. To reserve your own Computer you can E.mail us now on tony.computers(a)ic24.net If you E.mail your reservation and pay by cheque (payable to ViSa) you will qualify for FREE delivery normally �24.50. Alternatively, we accept most major credit cards, and if you choose, we won't debit your card until after your computer arrives. Please E.mail your order/reservation now tony.computers(a)ic24.net Regards David Liquidated Computers P.S. Remember, e.mail your order/reservation and receive FREE door to door delivery worth �24.50 E.Mail tony.computers(a)ic24.net Fax (01737) 823726 or (01293) 619035 Suite 112, 235 Earls Court Road, London, SW5 9FE We don't sell Laptop Computers .Your fax number can be suppressed in writing. Terms and Conditions apply.

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Language wars // was Re: [Alug] ALUG Library ...
by MJ Ray 03 May '01

03 May '01

David Freeman <david_freeman(a)rocketmail.com> writes: > XML has always appeared as a very complex thing which I haven't needed > to use for my very simple web site! Can any one recommend a good primer > for XML. Hrm, I can't remember where I learnt about it. Probably from webreference.com or similar. It's just like HTML but with consistency and your own tags, really. > I Am amazed that there is such a holy war about programming languages, > particully the language people first learnt was there favourite and all > others are programmed as if they were using the first language. Depending on your world-view and the task at hand, I now firmly believe that either everything is objects or everything is functions. This is miles away from my first language (BASIC) or my second (FORTH), but I tend to watch people and I've seen things that would make your toes curl. I guess others on this list will have seen worse, though. I don't really get into holy wars about language, though. I just try to avoid engaging with ones I dislike unless absolutely necessary. I have that luxury at the moment. -- MJR

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Re: [Alug] self intro
by MJ Ray 03 May '01

03 May '01

Joss Winn <joss(a)josswinn.org> writes: > Well, before the list admin finds a new member of the list who lives > in Japan [...] Oh, I don't think we'd notice another member from Japan that easily. Tats, are you still out there? -- MJR

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Re: [Alug] ALUG Library ...
by MJ Ray 03 May '01

03 May '01

Andrew Savory <a.savory(a)btinternet.com> writes: > Thoughts on what language to implement this in... Perl + DBI is nice and > quick, Calling Perl nice is not something I can bring myself to do any more. OK, it's possible to do some really well-crafted software in it, but it's possible to create some monstrosities too and more people do the latter. > [...] Ruby is always being mentioned to me but > I have no idea if it has DBI-like features or not. That'll be me, then. With Ruby, it's not quite so critical, as you just tweak your database object class. Even Perl's DBI isn't a perfect solution, because the SQLs don't seem to quite be the same. > [...] Then there's the evils of the world such as PHP, Embperl, > ASP.... can we steer clear of these? Please! While I can't call Perl nice, I won't program in PHP any more beyond simple tasks because of the mental anguish it causes. -- MJR

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Re: [Alug] IP Traffic monitoring
by Andrew.Chandler＠ft.com 03 May '01

03 May '01

It's a pity you haven't access to the Cisco (I assme the router is Cisco?) There's a nice command called "ip accounting". It will give you a table of IP addresses and how much traffic they have sent. I occasionally use this with an Expect script to drag back a set of network stats on a particular router. There are a number of non-intrusive methods too. We have some network probes that tap into the leased line and monitor it externally. A more expensive way of doing it though! Oh well just my 2 pence.... Andi "Mark Wilkinson" <mark(a)wiggis.com> on 02/05/2001 17:44:09 To: alug(a)stu.uea.ac.uk cc: (bcc: Andrew Chandler/PSD/LONDON/FTI) Subject: Re: [Alug] IP Traffic monitoring Hmm. That's where I was heading. The extract of the numbers is trivial and would give me 99% of their traffic. I'll try to knock something up in Perl that whacks the data into a MySQL database directly. Could be an interesting project. Cheers. M. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Raphael Mankin" <raph(a)panache.demon.co.uk> To: "Mark Wilkinson" <mark(a)wiggis.com> Cc: "alug" <alug(a)stu.uea.ac.uk> Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2001 5:26 PM Subject: RE: [Alug] IP Traffic monitoring It's in the Apache access log. Everything that is sent and how big it is. Not perfect; it does not include the overhead of setting up connections, but it is a start. On 02-May-01 Mark Wilkinson wrote: > Hi everyone. > > We are about to put a website online for an important customer but we want > to monitor the bandwidth usage on a monthly basis and bill them > accordingly. > > Has anyone any ideas on how to do IP Traffic monitoring? We don't have > access to the stats on our primary router (basically our upstream won't > give > us the data for some reason) so I just wanted to put some kind of packet > counter in.. > > Any ideas or package recommendations? I've looked at sourceforge but am not > sure of the products I'm finding there. I want a standalone product that > doesn't look like a beast to install and dumps the data in a nice format > for > sticking into a database. > > Cheers. > > Mark W. > > > > _______________________________________________ > alug, the Anglian Linux User Group list > Send list replies to alug(a)stu.uea.ac.uk > http://rabbit.stu.uea.ac.uk/cgi-bin/listinfo/alug > See the website for instructions on digest or unsub! ---------------------------------- ... all the fallacious exactitude that characterises a statistical table. - Eric Partridge E-Mail: Raphael Mankin <raph(a)panache.demon.co.uk> Date: 02-May-01 Time: 17:25:52 ---------------------------------- _______________________________________________ alug, the Anglian Linux User Group list Send list replies to alug(a)stu.uea.ac.uk http://rabbit.stu.uea.ac.uk/cgi-bin/listinfo/alug See the website for instructions on digest or unsub! ********************************************************************* * Please visit the web site of the Financial Times at: * * http://www.ft.com * * * * For UK personal finance, please visit http://www.ftyourmoney.com * * * * This E-Mail is intended for the use of the addressee only and may * * contain confidential information. If you are not the intended * * recipient, you are hereby notified that any use or dissemination * * of this communication is strictly prohibited. * * If you receive this transmission in error, please notify us * * immediately then delete this E-Mail. * * * * * postmaster(a)ft.com * ********************************************************************* ********************************************************************* * Please visit the web site of the Financial Times at: * * http://www.ft.com * * * * For UK personal finance, please visit http://www.ftyourmoney.com * * * * This E-Mail is intended for the use of the addressee only and may * * contain confidential information. If you are not the intended * * recipient, you are hereby notified that any use or dissemination * * of this communication is strictly prohibited. * * If you receive this transmission in error, please notify us * * immediately then delete this E-Mail. * * * * * postmaster(a)ft.com * *********************************************************************

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Re: [Alug] ALUG Library ...
by David Freeman 03 May '01

03 May '01

--- Steve Fosdick <fozzy(a)pelvoux.demon.co.uk> wrote: > On Wed, May 02, 2001 at 03:02:07PM -0700, David Freeman wrote: > > > --- brodders(a)cwcom.net wrote: > > > d) IF not web based - um, how's it going to work?? > > The big advantage of a web system is that is doesn't require any > additional software to be installed on the clients - prospective > clients should already have a web browser (and with care we can work > with any reasonable one) and if not we still don't have to write it - > it's just a case of installing it. Exactly, If we make the system well it should work on any browser, even IE :o) > The other options are: > > 1. Use the database's client server feature. The server machine just > runs a database with no other specialised software and a small > client is written using the revalent database library which then > communicates over a TCP connection to the database server. > > I know MySQL has this feature - it can be used for remote query > sessions too. PostgreSQL has it too. Down side - requires yet another app to be installed. > 2. Another protocol or RPC mechanism where a client program talks to > a > dedicated server process on the server machine which in turn > communicates with the database. > > This last approach can be flexible and can have low bandwidth > requirements but it would be the most work of any of them. <fx action=something going over my head> RPC sounds difficult. I think web based will be best. > > Badly? We want solutions not problems, ne ideas? > > Oh dear! This kind of speak is the worst kind of management clich�. Sorry, forgot the :o) . Also please don't accuse me of being a manager, I still have some (if limited) technically abilities :o) > > We also need to consider who has access to change/add things? > > Oh, so you probably want to define a set of priveleges and add a > "roles" table. How you model the next bit is open to debate. You > could have a many-to-one relationship between users and roles (many > users belong to one role, one role only per user) in which case some > roles have to include all the privileges of lesser roles. The other > way is to have a many-many between users and roles (thus a link > table). You could have a separate privileges table (almost a link > table) which lists role/priv pairs or you could make the privs > columns > of the roles table. We basically have two levels, people browsing for available books, and a librarian to add things. also I thought of another table reservation(member no., resource number, received) member no. and resource number = composite key = integers recieved = boolean. Thanks D > Steve __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices http://auctions.yahoo.com/

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